Do they really not allow contraception? But then the one child rule?

 

Yep, the levels of infanticide were unreal.... I guess they had to do something to get the population under control, but surely to fukk driving a campaign of birth control through contraception and sex education would be a lot better than punishing and creating a situation where parents were pretty much forced into committing unspeakable acts against their own kids lest they incur the wrath of their (fascist, authoritarian) State....

 

China being awarded the games is the best thing that could have happened

 

If China had not been awarded the games people would read about Tibet and think "poor Tibetans" and carry on munching their cornflakes in apathy as has happened over the last 30 years but instead the eyes of the world are on China and tibet is suddenly the hot topic of the day around the globe so the best thing that could have happened to the tibeans

 

But boycotts will not change anything in terms of China and will only punish the athletes themselves, if Britain pulled out would anyone outside of Britain give a monkeys we are not there when there is 140 other countries there ? no, it would just be a symbolic gesture that would get a few brief headlines and be forgotten about in a couple of days

China being awarded the games is the best thing that could have happened

If China had not been awarded the games people would read about Tibet and think "poor Tibetans" and carry on munching their cornflakes in apathy as has happened over the last 30 years but instead the eyes of the world are on China and tibet is suddenly the hot topic of the day around the globe so the best thing that could have happened to the tibeans

 

In a way, you've got a point, and this is probably the reason why the Dalai Lama is going along with it... Although, in secret, he's proabably rubbing his hands with glee that China is in the sh!tter...

 

But, I still believe we should boycott.. If us, the US, Canada, Australia, Europe and Russia (in other words, all the Olympic heavyweights...) all grew a pair (as France has done..), took a strong position and threatened to boycott the games unless China got its finger out its arse, Beijing '08 would potentially be utterly fukked, China would simply have to go to the negotiating table....

This is the whole trouble really. Your Media Teacher is both right and wrong.

 

Exactly. He also made the point that we're quite happy to import millions of pounds of goods from china to sell dirt cheap and make money, but as soon as this comes along we hate them LOL.

 

 

China being awarded the games is the best thing that could have happened

 

If China had not been awarded the games people would read about Tibet and think "poor Tibetans" and carry on munching their cornflakes in apathy as has happened over the last 30 years but instead the eyes of the world are on China and tibet is suddenly the hot topic of the day around the globe so the best thing that could have happened to the tibeans

 

But boycotts will not change anything in terms of China and will only punish the athletes themselves, if Britain pulled out would anyone outside of Britain give a monkeys we are not there when there is 140 other countries there ? no, it would just be a symbolic gesture that would get a few brief headlines and be forgotten about in a couple of days

 

You make a good point, but i stand by the fact as many people as possible should boycott. However, us boycotting could result in us potentially losing the imports from China which i mentioned above. I mean, i think if as many people as possible do boycott china WILL have to stand up and be counted but there are many side effects to consider.

 

I think smallish countries boycotting the olympics like Austria, Portugal could start a chain.

I completely disagree with the "politics shouldnt mix with sport" principle. Imo, the deaths of over 100 innocent Tibetans (and thats just in the last few weeks) should be a bigger issue than a few gold medals. Its unfortunate for athletes if theres a boycott, but excuse me for thinking that Tibetans lives being saved is a little more important than them padding their CVs.

Id like to see a boycott, but it could only happen if a large number of the major countries agreed to it. Brown going it alone would be brave but ultimately totally moronic. We cant afford to be the only ones to p*** off such an ESSENTIAL trading partner... if all the majors boycotted it though, China obviously couldnt sever trading with all of them.

So yes, Id like the major powers to tell China that theyll boycott unless negotiations start with the Dalai Lama and they make a solid pledge to massively improve their human rights policies, effective immediately. I wouldnt agree with trying to actually bring down the regime though... how they govern their country is their business, just as long as they dont violate human rights.

As for the protests - I think its wrong to try and grab the Torch off someone, or to try and extinguish it. Other than that, I dont see any problems with them, and think confiscating banners saying things like "Free Tibet" is completely wrong.

well ive been out all day, seems ive missed an interesting debate here! :lol:

 

of course i agree with grimly and cod.

Of course, now there's another reason why Beijing should NOT be given the games...

 

...The absolutely frightening levels of Pollution (which makes LA and London seem positively healthy...) that they've done absolutely BUGGER ALL ABOUT.. Yet ANOTHER promise made to the IOC that the Chinese Govt has resolutely failed to deliver on....

 

Yeah, come to Beijing.. Watch the games.. See the athletes collapse yards from the finish line clutching their chests and wheezing... See the marathon runners in downtown Beijing wearing fukkin' GASMASKS or RESPIRATORS....... <_<

 

Anyone still believe this fukked-up, lying, cheating, murdering, dirty regime deserves the games....?

:mellow:

 

Lets begin with the following things:

 

- Not allowing contraception, but if you have more than one child it is , which tbph is just SICK.

- Telling citizens what they are allowed to do, earn and think. No freedom of speech and anyone who breaks the policies is severly punished.

- i reitterate, no freedom of speech

- Lets not forget Tibet

- They dont allow journalists into the country, yet as soon as the Olympics is in town everyones flocking in

 

I severly disagree with your statement. Yes, American are bad, but i dont think China is on a par with them :S

 

1.one chlid policy is not very well excuted ,esp in the country area,a lot of my roommates has brothers and sisters,government will fine them,but murdered?where do you get that idea

2.what you mean by contraception? codom?u can buy it EVERYWHERE

3.every country tells its citizen what to do, earn and think,but you don't need to agree with what they said.great fire wall is terrible,but it's most people know how to use proxy,so actullay only a few people complety buy in what cctv says.

4.the reason why they don't allow journalists into tibet is that chinese official always play it safe,if they allow foregin reporters in then things go out of control,then they may lose their job.so they only allow repoters in until they have everything under control

5.people has freedom of speech,but if u happen to talk about someone who has a background,u may be in trouble

i do hope u guys learn more about china before u make a point,china has a lot of problem,but it's no way near hell

you have to remember that we are the next hosts, anything we do over china could come and bite us in the ass

1.one chlid policy is not very well excuted ,esp in the country area,a lot of my roommates has brothers and sisters,government will fine them,but murdered?where do you get that idea

2.what you mean by contraception? codom?u can buy it EVERYWHERE

3.every country tells its citizen what to do, earn and think,but you don't need to agree with what they said.great fire wall is terrible,but it's most people know how to use proxy,so actullay only a few people complety buy in what cctv says.

4.the reason why they don't allow journalists into tibet is that chinese official always play it safe,if they allow foregin reporters in then things go out of control,then they may lose their job.so they only allow repoters in until they have everything under control

5.people has freedom of speech,but if u happen to talk about someone who has a background,u may be in trouble

i do hope u guys learn more about china before u make a point,china has a lot of problem,but it's no way near hell

 

1| What about the forced sterilisations [especially in Tibet] that have been kept such a well hidden secret?

3| Not every country tells its citizens what to do, earn and think..the ability to use your own mind and achieve/do what you want is part of freedom. The repression of many websites on the internet is just one way the right of freedom is not able to be fully excercised within Chinese territory.

4| ''Playing It Safe'' is not why journalists pursue the career that they have, and the authorities not allowing gaijin's in is hiding the truth of the regime.

5| Then that is not free speech..that is repression.

 

I don't think anyone is saying China is ''hell'' - It's a very beautiful and diverse country with a fascinating history, but for the most part it isn't free..and the repression of it's people and their rights is not at all justifiable.

1| What about the forced sterilisations [especially in Tibet] that have been kept such a well hidden secret?

3| Not every country tells its citizens what to do, earn and think..the ability to use your own mind and achieve/do what you want is part of freedom. The repression of many websites on the internet is just one way the right of freedom is not able to be fully excercised within Chinese territory.

4| ''Playing It Safe'' is not why journalists pursue the career that they have, and the authorities not allowing gaijin's in is hiding the truth of the regime.

5| Then that is not free speech..that is repression.

 

I don't think anyone is saying China is ''hell'' - It's a very beautiful and diverse country with a fascinating history, but for the most part it isn't free..and the repression of it's people and their rights is not at all justifiable.

1.forced sterilisations ?if so,it sure is a hidden secret,at least my roommates from seven different provience never heard about that around their family and friends.plus,the poplation and living age of tibet people is going up.

3.yes,they do.the government incourage things.but most not mandatory.isn't that happen around the world?

4.i'm not trying to say they do the right thing,i'm explaing their way of thinking,if you see from that point of view,u may understand that not allowing foregin repoters not necessarily (though could be) related to hiding the truth

5.politcally speaking yes,but does that interfere our daily life?no

no one literally say hell,but people here really has a very unreal and shocking bad picture of china...

And don't get me started on the fact that the PRC are responsible for 90% of the World's executions and are rated 169th out of 176 nations for human rights, freedom of speech, etc.

90% of the World's executions sounds high,but don't forget that chinese has a population of 1.4 billion,and only neraly 30 country use executions

I'll agree that the media is very anti-China in the west.

 

The population of Tibetans has actually gone down in the last 10 years, while the amount of Chinese people entering the region has increased..Chinese has become the premier language of the sub country. Governments throughout the world encourage certain things, but for the most part their ideas aren't somehow forced onto the public. The sterilisation matter was uncovered recently by a documentary on which interviewed a woman claiming she either pay an unreasonable amount of money per month for her children, or be forcibly sterilised by the government.

 

In China, there are 3,500 executions a year..I don't think the size of the country makes a difference, since Iran is smaller than the U.S and had 160 executions last year [population of 70 million] while the US had 60 [Population of 300 million] - the US has 20 Executions per 100 million people, while China has 270.

 

Obviously i'm not blaming the people here such as yourself...it's the regime and the government. things have gotten better obviously and I'm sure they will continue to.. but there are insane violations that are happening, and yes, free speech does effect everyone.. just like any political issues. D:

I'll agree that the media is very anti-China in the west.

 

The population of Tibetans has actually gone down in the last 10 years, while the amount of

 

Chinese people entering the region has increased..Chinese has become the premier

 

language of the sub country. Governments throughout the world encourage certain things,

 

but for the most part their ideas aren't somehow forced onto the public. The sterilisation

 

matter was uncovered recently by a documentary on which interviewed a woman claiming

 

she either pay an unreasonable amount of money per month for her children, or be forcibly

 

sterilised by the government.

 

In China, there are 3,500 executions a year..I don't think the size of the country makes a

 

difference, since Iran is smaller than the U.S and had 160 executions last year [population

 

of 70 million] while the US had 60 [Population of 300 million] - the US has 20 Executions per

 

100 million people, while China has 270.

 

Obviously i'm not blaming the people here such as yourself...it's the regime and the

 

government. things have gotten better obviously and I'm sure they will continue to.. but

 

there are insane violations that are happening, and yes, free speech does effect everyone..

 

just like any political issues. D:

 

1.according to the data given by tibet government last year,95 of tibet people are

 

Tibetans,i don't think dalailama and his force has the access and power to do a proper

 

research in such a big area

 

2.i'm not sure the documentary is dependable, it's probably done by some local government

 

and it's against the law in the first place,the fine should be one-off,let alone the sterilisation

 

part.but if the documentary claims it happen everywhere in china,then it's taking things out

 

of context.

 

3.i don't think 3500 is a big number.this is a very traditional and well-agreed thought that "if

 

u kill someone,u compensate with your life".i think most chinese people think murders

 

robbers and (esp) corruption crimials deserve executions.that's tradition.i think the low

 

execution rate in us also has traditional and religionus factors.Q:do u think those local

 

governor who make and excute sterilisation deserve executions?

 

4.Not every policy in china is forced,otherwise i wouldn't use "incourage" in the first

 

place.Like they want to incourage people to use public traffic,so they make fair cheaper.It's

 

not as if they put a gun on our back all the time.

 

5.i don't see a reason why uk should boycott olympic.sure the regime is f***ed up or

 

whatever,but are u complaing when benifict from trade?As for tibet,i haven't seen any legit

 

evidence to prove that it's the police not the monks who killed the innocent,yet everyone

 

seems to jump on the bandwagon (there's loads of fake picture on www.anti-cnn.com,which

 

got attacked by hecker recently for some reason) .those chinese blogs who laugh & diss

 

government all the time are against the western media now.Before this accident,western

 

media are like cnn and bbc are widely believed,but after a strings of casual mistakes,they're

 

almost as stinky as cctv.they're the biggest loser of the incident so far.if uk boycott the

 

game,there will be a lot of the uncessary hostility and tension going on---not on the

 

government side(i don't think they'll boycott 2012 even if uk boycott 2008),but those

 

ordinary people like me.

 

A few question:

a.if u are the leader of china,will u try to ingite enthic problem months before Olympics?

b.if riot do happen,how will u try to minimaize the effect?if u are a local governor,how can u make sure allowing the foriegn reporters won't lead to making things up or trying to make things wrose?if things get taken out of context,how can u take the resposibility?

c.if there's a riot and it cause a lot of blood or viloence,will u send some army to maintain the order?But dose that means those blood or viloence are caused by the army?

d.who is most likely to befinit from such a riot?

e.what's the possiblity of two areas with a distance of 1400kilo starts a riot on the same day without former preparation?

f.what about a series of attack towards embassy?that begins before 3.14.

g.do u think there's absolute justice and evil in politic?

h.if there's a riot in,say,Basque,will u boycott spain?

I never actually said a boycott of the Olympic games is a good idea..I said that it would cripple us just as much as it would be negative publicity and further claims of infringes of human rights for you. And if you don't believe reputable news sites like CNN and BBC..what about the exiled Tibetan government? I mean I'm sure there's a middle ground between what them and the Chinese government are claiming, but I don't see how it's possible to say that there were more deaths caused by monks..especially when they live a live of peace and believe in non-violent methods of protestation. I'm sure they don't force all their ideas on the people..but if they really want something then it will be, like making Chinese the official language in Tibet rather than Tibetan [i think you got confused here that I was saying there are more Chinese people in tibet than its natives..i should have clarified :P]

 

a.if u are the leader of china,will u try to ingite enthic problem months before Olympics?

b.if riot do happen,how will u try to minimaize the effect?if u are a local governor,how can u make sure allowing the foriegn reporters won't lead to making things up or trying to make things wrose?if things get taken out of context,how can u take the resposibility?

c.if there's a riot and it cause a lot of blood or viloence,will u send some army to maintain the order?But dose that means those blood or viloence are caused by the army?..

d.who is most likely to befinit from such a riot?

e.what's the possiblity of two areas with a distance of 1400kilo starts a riot on the same day without former preparation?

f.what about a series of attack towards embassy?that begins before 3.14.

g.do u think there's absolute justice and evil in politic?

h.if there's a riot in,say,Basque,will u boycott spain?

 

1| I wouldn't try to ignite anything..what i would try to do is sort out the the obvious problems with my country. I know this is easier said than done due to the vast size and differentiating dialects, but they've had over four years to at least TRY to sort out some problems.

2| No matter what happens anywhere in the world..the media will exaggerate it..it's part of the job description..however not all media outlets are like that, there are many very reliable journalists and magazines

3| The protests are usually peaceful until the army/police come to 'stop' them... and i'm actually speaking from near-personal experience on this.

4| Nobody is going to benefit.. but the more the government represses and tries to stop news of it's abuses getting out the more obvious it becomes that it is happening and that more needs to be done about it.

 

I don't understand these two questions sorry D:

 

7| there is no such thing as absolute justice in politics, but there is for injustice..for the people of whatever realm it concerns anyway

8| It depends on the riot..the extent of the damage..what the riot is about, and whether the country can economically/politically risk doing such a thing. There are so many factors involved.

 

你有良好的英语. 我只會說一點兒中國話。 D:

1.forced sterilisations ?if so,it sure is a hidden secret,at least my roommates from seven different provience never heard about that around their family and friends.plus,the poplation and living age of tibet people is going up.

3.yes,they do.the government incourage things.but most not mandatory.isn't that happen around the world?

4.i'm not trying to say they do the right thing,i'm explaing their way of thinking,if you see from that point of view,u may understand that not allowing foregin repoters not necessarily (though could be) related to hiding the truth

5.politcally speaking yes,but does that interfere our daily life?no

no one literally say hell,but people here really has a very unreal and shocking bad picture of china...

 

Why are you being such a pathetic apologist for your country's clealy fascistic regime....? Do you see me or other Brit posters making excuses for our actions in Iraq or other things that they do wrong...? NO, we don't.. When our country does something that resolutely SUCKS, we say it loud an proud and we challenge authority.... You lot in China just seem far too accepting of what your Govt gets up to... THAT's the problem....

 

I'm beginning to wonder, considering the content of your posts, that you're not working for some 'Beijing 2008' PR company tbh.....

 

Why are you being such a pathetic apologist for your country's clealy fascistic regime....? Do you see me or other Brit posters making excuses for our actions in Iraq or other things that they do wrong...? NO, we don't.. When our country does something that resolutely SUCKS, we say it loud an proud and we challenge authority.... You lot in China just seem far too accepting of what your Govt gets up to... THAT's the problem....

 

I'm beginning to wonder, considering the content of your posts, that you're not working for some 'Beijing 2008' PR company tbh.....

I agree mostly, it is most probable that this person believes everything that is printed in the official newspapers... which you could probably imagine isn't the most balanced source of information :lol: (Although it has improved, slightly).

 

I don't see how you can say that British people "challenge authority" though, infact I think we could be well one of the most politically apathetic nations on earth. There has been no threat of any revolution... not even in the 1930's when things were really $h!t... like there was in Germany. Or anything on the scale of when there was near revolution in 1968 in France. Ok, there has been a few riots, a few big strikes (what use did most of them do though?) and none threatened a revolution of any kind.

 

Just look at the voting turnout figures!

I completely disagree with the "politics shouldnt mix with sport" principle. Imo, the deaths of over 100 innocent Tibetans (and thats just in the last few weeks)

 

Our occupation of Iraq killed over 20,000 Iraqis in ONE NIGHT in "shock and awe", our occupation of Iraq was illegal and against the UN mandate, Abu Ghirab prison atrocities were the most despicable behaviour I have seen from a military in my lifetime, Britain also has big curbs on freedom of speech where dissenters like the heckler of Jack Straw were arrested under the prevention of terrorism act, where protests and demonstrations have been banned in Parliament Square, where anti war campaigners who were peacefully demonstrating were attacked by police, where we have the least amount of privacy in the western world

 

Do you think there should be a boycott of the British games ?

 

 

Our occupation of Iraq killed over 20,000 Iraqis in ONE NIGHT in "shock and awe", our occupation of Iraq was illegal and against the UN mandate, Abu Ghirab prison atrocities were the most despicable behaviour I have seen from a military in my lifetime, Britain also has big curbs on freedom of speech where dissenters like the heckler of Jack Straw were arrested under the prevention of terrorism act, where protests and demonstrations have been banned in Parliament Square, where anti war campaigners who were peacefully demonstrating were attacked by police, where we have the least amount of privacy in the western world

 

Do you think there should be a boycott of the British games ?

 

If we're still occupying Iraq in 2012, and the authoritarian, Police-State endorsing, Nu Labor is still in power, then yes I would actually propose a boycott of London 2012.....

 

And the Poster is absolutely spot on, the term "Politics and Sport shouldn't mix" is a weak, lily-livered, cowardly position to take.... Especially when it is absolutely apparent to anyone with a brain to think and eyes to see, that China is using the Olympics as a political propaganda tool.....