May 11, 200916 yr lol.. today its the tories who are being exposed..... and we go on about benefits cheats! :lol: :lol: In all seriousness though, for MPs to go on about people "scrounging" on the dole is seriously the pot calling the kettle black...... They've really not got a leg to stand on...
May 11, 200916 yr Now MPs are rejecting calls for the police to be called in to investigate the irregularities we're witnessing. How much more of an admission of guilt do they require? Gordon Brown called for new laws to be introduced to "deal with" the benefitors of the RBS scandal, but his opposers rejected it. Any chance of a mechanism to deal with the MPs rejecting police intervention? Of course not! It seems that there's no end to this corrupt democracy we live in.
May 12, 200916 yr We are not perfect by any means but I would imagine Labour's ones are way worse And it is worse for Labour because Tory culture is based on greed whereas Labour is supposed to be the champion of the poor and the working class and stand for an equal society but here are people who are supposed to believe in that doing stuff that would make Gordon Gekko blush Do you still think this? Swimming pools, plumbing repairs under the tennis court, paddocks etc. All claimed by Tory MPs. And who claimed over £400 for a chauffeur to drive him to London, claiming the full amount despite getting a 5% discount for prompt payment? George Osbourne, that's who. Hasn't he heard of trains? Good to see the Hate Mail acting in their usual way. There's nothing about Tory expense claims in today's edition. Don't worry, I washed my hands thoroughly after touching it.
May 12, 200916 yr Do you still think this? Swimming pools, plumbing repairs under the tennis court, paddocks etc. All claimed by Tory MPs. And who claimed over £400 for a chauffeur to drive him to London, claiming the full amount despite getting a 5% discount for prompt payment? George Osbourne, that's who. Hasn't he heard of trains? Good to see the Hate Mail acting in their usual way. There's nothing about Tory expense claims in today's edition. Don't worry, I washed my hands thoroughly after touching it. I condemn all fraud whatever the party and David Cameron has acted swiftly to deal with it and has made the MP's pay the money back, Brown should make the Labour MP's do the same
May 12, 200916 yr I condemn all fraud whatever the party and David Cameron has acted swiftly to deal with it and has made the MP's pay the money back, Brown should make the Labour MP's do the same I notice you didn't answer my question. Anyway, yes, Brown should make sure the unjustifiable claims are paid back. And, if there are any unjustifiable claims by Lib Dem MPs, Nick Clegg should do the same. However, I suspect the Tory MPs will find it easier to pay the money back out of what they will consider to be petty cash. Apart from Shaun Woodward and Baraba Follett of course.
May 12, 200916 yr I notice you didn't answer my question. Anyway, yes, Brown should make sure the unjustifiable claims are paid back. And, if there are any unjustifiable claims by Lib Dem MPs, Nick Clegg should do the same. However, I suspect the Tory MPs will find it easier to pay the money back out of what they will consider to be petty cash. Apart from Shaun Woodward and Baraba Follett of course. Clegg has already said that profits made on second hpmes should be paid back - and rightly so. Of course, it should be pointed out that it was Thatcher who changed the rules so that the second home allowance covered mortgage payments as well as rent.
May 12, 200916 yr Fraud is fraud, to me it doesn't matter what party it is it is wrong as it is my tax that is being used to fund their lifestyle But 1) Labour have had 12 years to amend the system 2) Labour are the champion of the poor and the working class and tories champions of the middle classes and the wealthy so given labour MP's are elected by the poorest people in society it is more morally wrong for them to have their noses in the trough than say a tory MP who is elected by wealthier people
May 13, 200916 yr Fraud is fraud, to me it doesn't matter what party it is it is wrong as it is my tax that is being used to fund their lifestyle But 1) Labour have had 12 years to amend the system and the tories had 12 years to oppose them! but didnt because their snouts were in the same trough.
May 13, 200916 yr As far as i am aware, no Lib Dem MP's have been involved in the scandal so far. New Labour are so hypocritical it is unreal, they beat the SNP's ever changing policies.
May 13, 200916 yr As far as i am aware, no Lib Dem MP's have been involved in the scandal so far. New Labour are so hypocritical it is unreal, they beat the SNP's ever changing policies. yep they have...its their turn for 'outing' today.
May 13, 200916 yr Oh, ok I'll pipe down. I'm not totally clued in with this story. Of course i condemn my money being abused in such a fashion, and i dearly hope my MP [sir Ming C] isn't involved in it. My ex lives near him in Gateside
May 13, 200916 yr MPs’ expenses: Andrew George claimed for £308,000 flat used by daughter as 'bolt hole’ Andrew George, a Liberal Democrat MP, is facing questions about his parliamentary expenses claims for a £300,000 London flat used by his student daughter while several of his party colleagues are under similar scrutiny ---------------------- Andrew George, the MP for St Ives, claims £847 a month from taxpayers on mortgage interest payments for the riverside flat. But the home insurance policy included on his expenses file is in the name of his 21-year-old daughter, Morvah George, a student who has worked as a professional model and as an intern for her father in Parliament. On Tuesday night, Mr George admitted his daughter kept some of her belongings there and used it as a “bolt-hole” but denied she spent more time there than him. He said his insurers had prevented him from being named on the policy as well as on one at his Cornish home. Mr George’s claims reveal how MPs are able to use the system to buy properties from which their families can benefit. The disclosures come on the sixth day of The Daily Telegraph’s investigation into MPs’ expenses, which indicates that Liberal Democrats have made claims just as questionable as their Labour and Conservative counterparts. Nick Clegg, the Liberal Democrat leader,said MPs should have to return any profits they make on their second homes to the taxpayer. As the spotlight on MPs' expenses turned on his party, Mr Clegg said he had always intended to give back any profits that he makes when he eventually comes to sell up. He said he could now be requiring members of his frontbench team to do the same until there were new rules in place. He told BBC Radio 4's Today programme he would prevent any of his party's shadow cabinet from making any money by selling houses until the rules were reformed and said any new guidelines should "get MPs out of the property game". He told Sky News he said he would come down like a "ton of bricks" on any of his party's MPs who made "profit for personal gain in the property market". “We are MPs, not property speculators," he said. "I have said I will voluntarily make sure that any money that is gained from the sale of my house goes back to the taxpayer. I also now say that the Liberal Democrat shadow cabinet will do the same until new rules are in place. In my view the only long-term solution is get MPs out of the property game altogether. "So far, to my knowledge, not a single Liberal Democrat MP has committed the biggest abuse which has emerged in the revelations over the last few days, and that is flipping from one home to the other to avoid capital gains tax and to make a big personal profit," he said. Mr Clegg claimed the maximum possible on his second home allowance and exceeded his budget by more than £100 at the same time as he was calling for the reform of the system. He has now promised to repay a phone bill that included calls to Colombia and Vietnam. Files seen by this newspaper also show: * Sir Menzies Campbell, the former leader, hired an interior designer to refurbish his flat in central London, spending nearly £10,000 of taxpayers’ money on scatter cushions, a king-sized bed and a flat screen television. * Chris Huhne, the party’s home affairs spokesman, claimed for a £119 trouser press that was delivered to his main home rather than his designated second address. He has agreed to pay back the money. He also claimed for fluffy dusters and the upkeep of his “pergola cross beam”. * Lembit Opik, the high-profile housing spokesman, charged taxpayers for a £40 court summons he received for the non-payment of his council tax. He will refund it. * Julia Goldsworthy, the Treasury spokesman, bought a leather rocking chair from Heal’s as she spent thousands of pounds just days before the deadline for using the second homes allowance. One of the most questionable cases is that of Mr George, an MP since 1997. He lives in his Cornish constituency with his wife and stayed in hotels in the capital when at Westminster. In March 2006, he told the fees office he was planning to lease a flat and then used his second home allowance before securing the lease, claiming back £1,898 spent on furnishings, including a sofa and beds that were in fact delivered to his main home in Cornwall. However, he continued to stay in hotels in the capital and eight months later was sent a letter by Commons officials stating: “I should be grateful if you would let me know whether or not you still intend to lease the flat.” Mr George eventually bought a two-bed flat overlooking the Thames, in a gated block in Rotherhithe, for £308,000 in January 2007 and soon after put in a £3,999 bill for furniture and household items including a television, lamps, blinds, a bed and a futon. This was reduced by £1,488.95 by the fees office, which said: “You have already claimed for a bed in anticipation of your purchase of a second home. You may not claim living costs for anyone other than yourself.” Mr George complained, writing back: “I wanted two beds for the second bedroom when my family come to stay.” He was allowed to claim back the £538 cost of a futon after telling them it was “living room furniture” rather than another bed, and the following month claimed £388.41 for more furniture and homeware. In 2007-08, he billed taxpayers for £1,343.81 in household goods and redecoration including a new bath, although a claim to have the archway between the hallway and lounge removed was rejected. His file indicates that the £223.04 annual home insurance policy with the Post Office was taken out solely in the name of his daughter, listed as “Miss M George”. She began studying in London in autumn 2007, just months after her father bought the flat. Commons rules state that MPs must only use the second homes allowance to claim back living costs that they themselves incur. Neighbours confirmed they had seen Miss George regularly in the area. Last night her father said she had been in halls of residence in her first year and now lived with her boyfriend. He admitted she did stay in his riverside flat but denied she was there more often than him. “It’s her bolt-hole, she comes there to and fro which is something I appreciate because I’m not there all the time. It suits me and it suits her. She keeps her belongings there. She comes there to pick up things and sometimes it’s the best place for us to meet. “All of the items purchased were moved into the flat where they are now, after having been moved to storage in London." “My wife arranged the insurance for the flat. Because we have Post Office insurance on our main home in Cornwall, we were not allowed to have our name on another policy at another address. We therefore asked our daughter if she would be the named person as she occasionally keeps an eye on the flat for us.” http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...-bolt-hole.html Spoke too soon
May 13, 200916 yr I was amazed by the diversity of some of the claims: Gervais Massivwad (Tory) somewhere darn-saarf - £55,000 - upkeep of replica Hanging Gardens of Babylon! Albert Tittlemass (Labour) somewhere oop-north - £7.55 - tripe & biscuits for t'whippet and dry-cleaning of flat cap! Norma Edited May 13, 200916 yr by Norma_Snockers
May 13, 200916 yr Wait a sec. Lembit Opik FAILED to pay tax, and then used money derived from other people's TAXES to pay the fine? I know it's only £40, but that is utterly indefensible.
May 14, 200916 yr This gravy train has got to come to an end. :rolleyes: Initially when I read of the scandal concerning Damian Green, I thought that neither the Speaker or the Deputy Speaker should be from the Government side of the house. Now, looking at this wonderful MPs' expenses row, I think that they should be civil servants and completely impartial to serve there in the public interest, not the party interest or their colleagues' interests. Should be interesting to see if the European Parliament will be investigated as well. Edited May 14, 200916 yr by Flatcap
May 14, 200916 yr if we diddled the system the way some of these characters have, we would be facing criminal actions against us....
May 14, 200916 yr if we diddled the system the way some of these characters have, we would be facing criminal actions against us.... Exactly I read yesterday that 3 police officers have been arrested over expenses claims while they were on duty, these MP's should be arrested too by police and where appropriate charged with fraud and theft
May 14, 200916 yr I think we all knew that MP's fiddled expenses (or took massive liberties) so I'm not really shocked by it at all. Nothing will change and there's nothing we can do about it anyway. Making the most of 'expenses' if you're one of the lucky ones who fit into the bracket of 'expense-claiming' staff - goes on in most public sector areas - Councils, Housing, NHS, etc. I'm not defending it or saying its right in any way - it just happens. Norma Edited May 14, 200916 yr by Norma_Snockers
May 14, 200916 yr Exactly I read yesterday that 3 police officers have been arrested over expenses claims while they were on duty, these MP's should be arrested too by police and where appropriate charged with fraud and theft the scale of this is still becoming apparent with one twat claiming 16k... yes SIXTEEN THOUSAND POUNDS that he wasnt entitled too for a house that was paid for... ffs... JAIL THE CNUT. this makes moaning about benefits cheats very hard to balance... the police should be brought in and everyone should be convicted IF they have done wrong... no appology is sufficient, paying back monies yes...WITH INTEREST (as i have to if my tax is late). this sleaze is party wide and is utterly disgusting, jail the worst offenders, sack the pisstakers.
May 14, 200916 yr I think we all knew that MP's fiddled expenses (or took massive liberties) so I'm not really shocked by it at all. Nothing will change and there's nothing we can do about it anyway. Making the most of 'expenses' if you're one of the lucky ones who fit into the bracket of 'expense-claiming' staff - goes on in most public sector areas - Councils, Housing, NHS, etc. I'm not defending it or saying its right in any way - it just happens. Norma But that's the point. Most MPs have been taking liberties rather than fiddling expenses. Taking liberties is not against the law. The only case which is clearly potentially fraud is the MP who continued to claim mortgage interest after the mortgage had been paid off. I can't see how he managed to do that "accidentally".
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