Now the hardcores in Labour are trying (and likely to suceed) in scrapping the deputy leadership position - whilst at the parties conference.

 

A takeover of socialist workers, Marxists and communists are pretty much robbing the country of a progressive party.

Corbyn has managed to placate Tom Watson and his allies ever since the threat of a lot of Labour members departing for Change UK by letting them have their own caucus within the Labour Party, but if the Corbynites take away his leadership position? Well, that might encourage them to pull themselves away for good. It looks like Corbyn's allies have taken a page out of Boris Johnson's book by attempting to cut away the branches that are getting in their way. He better pray he didn't hack at the roots by accident.

Corbyn has managed to placate Tom Watson and his allie ever since the threat of a lot of Labour members departing for Change UK by letting them have their own caucus within the Labour Party, but if the Corbynites take away his leadership position? Well, that might encourage them to pull themselves away for good. It looks like Corbyn's allies have taken a page out of Boris Johnson's book by attempting to cut away the branches that are getting in their way. He better pray he didn't hack at the roots by accident.

 

It's why this Labour leadership will never enter power. I actually think a lot of it is the people advising Corbyn rather than the man himself. They are basically doing what the Tories are doing and allowing the extreme idelology to take over.

 

You'd think looking at the elections of the past 30-40 years that to win a majority if you are Labour, you have to attract voters that have voted Conservative and if you are Conservative you have to attract voters that have voted Labour before.

And this comes off the backs of Labour Students, the students affiliate of the party, being dissolved by the NEC. As the joke goes, they're the first student affiliated group to be dissolved for not being radical enough.

It's why this Labour leadership will never enter power. I actually think a lot of it is the people advising Corbyn rather than the man himself. They are basically doing what the Tories are doing and allowing the extreme idelology to take over.

 

You'd think looking at the elections of the past 30-40 years that to win a majority if you are Labour, you have to attract voters that have voted Conservative and if you are Conservative you have to attract voters that have voted Labour before.

 

What's extremist about his policies?

 

That's the thing 'centrists' always think they are the sane, rational and mainstream voice in society and yet these are the people who brought us the Iraq war, free market economics and producing an environment where people feel they can't take control of their lives which leads to busts and economic depression and ultimately Brexit.

Edited September 21, 20197 yr by Steve201

It's why this Labour leadership will never enter power. I actually think a lot of it is the people advising Corbyn rather than the man himself. They are basically doing what the Tories are doing and allowing the extreme idelology to take over.

 

You'd think looking at the elections of the past 30-40 years that to win a majority if you are Labour, you have to attract voters that have voted Conservative and if you are Conservative you have to attract voters that have voted Labour before.

 

Unfortunately there's no convincing AQ of that though - he's under the bizarre impression that there's a secret army of socialists out there, being suppressed by the 'landed-gentry', who will magically appear at the next election. :lol:

 

Of course, when they don't, he will be unable to accept that that's down to the unpopularity of the ideology, and try to blame 'the usual suspects' instead. :rolleyes:

Watson's been invisible these last few weeks and has he ever stood in for Corbyn anywhere? Never seen him do PMQ's. Trouble is,there's no Deputy election unless he resigns. If there was I'm sure he'd lose.

 

Also was reading that even if Labour lose to Boris a lot of Momentum want Corbyn to stay leader. WTF. two election losses. Let's hope he'd see sense and resign then.

Edited September 21, 20197 yr by Common Sense

Watson's been invisible these last few weeks and has he ever stood in for Corbyn anywhere? Never seen him do PMQ's. Trouble is,there's no Deputy election unless he resigns. If there was I'm sure he'd lose.

 

Also was reading that even if Labour lose to Boris a lot of Momentum want him to stay leader. WTF. two election losses. Let's hope he'd see sense and resign then.

 

Given his age, his health may become an issue, too? He'll be 73 at the next *scheduled* GE, and 78 at the one following...

Edited September 21, 20197 yr by vidcapper

What's extremist about his policies?

 

That's the thing 'centrists' always think they are the sane, rational and mainstream voice in society and yet these are the people who brought us the Iraq war, free market economics and producing an environment where people feel they can't take control of their lives which leads to busts and economic depression and ultimately Brexit.

 

Corbyn himself isn't extreme, but a lot of his influencers are. So many socialists and Marxists have joined the party and they are just as bad as the far-right. Surely to create an equal and strong party you mix the views. Just like the Tories have purged the moderates, Labour seem hell bent of purging the Blarities.

 

Watson's been invisible these last few weeks and has he ever stood in for Corbyn anywhere? Never seen him do PMQ's. Trouble is,there's no Deputy election unless he resigns. If there was I'm sure he'd lose.

 

Also was reading that even if Labour lose to Boris a lot of Momentum want Corbyn to stay leader. WTF. two election losses. Let's hope he'd see sense and resign then.

 

I take it as more of a strategic move in the event Corbyn loses the next GE as he will resign. Just means they can choose their own candidate rather than Watson overseeing the proceedings. Momentum are outsting a leader that was elected by the party membership.

 

Corbyn himself isn't extreme, but a lot of his influencers are. So many socialists and Marxists have joined the party and they are just as bad as the far-right. Surely to create an equal and strong party you mix the views. Just like the Tories have purged the moderates, Labour seem hell bent of purging the Blarities.

I take it as more of a strategic move in the event Corbyn loses the next GE as he will resign. Just means they can choose their own candidate rather than Watson overseeing the proceedings. Momentum are outsting a leader that was elected by the party membership.

 

How? I'm genuinely curious as I can't think of any recent examples of the left being as bad as the far-right in the UK.

Edited September 21, 20197 yr by blacksquare

How? I'm genuinely curious as I can't think of any recent examples of the left being as bad as the far-right in the UK.

 

I meant far-left, so all of these commies, Marxists, extreme Socialists who have joined thr Labour Party over these past 4 years. They are esentially trying to shut out Tom Watson from having any influence in the party because they don't like his views. Might I add, these people are not even elected members they are just people that have far too much influence over a party. Fair enough if you don't agree with someone's views - challenge them. This is just an act of pure cowadice. Boris Johnson must be pissing himself this morning.

What's extremist about his policies?

 

That's the thing 'centrists' always think they are the sane, rational and mainstream voice in society and yet these are the people who brought us the Iraq war, free market economics and producing an environment where people feel they can't take control of their lives which leads to busts and economic depression and ultimately Brexit.

 

THIS!!!!!

 

I meant far-left, so all of these commies, Marxists, extreme Socialists who have joined thr Labour Party over these past 4 years. They are esentially trying to shut out Tom Watson from having any influence in the party because they don't like his views. Might I add, these people are not even elected members they are just people that have far too much influence over a party. Fair enough if you don't agree with someone's views - challenge them. This is just an act of pure cowadice. Boris Johnson must be pissing himself this morning.

WROOONG.

 

He is a saboteur who attacks the leadership and policies at every turn?

 

We have moderate European left policies. Also Marxism is bettee than this late stage neoliberal capitalism we have, so even if it were true, sooo?

 

Momentum really are gaining too much control over the party.

 

We have the two main parties increasingly heading towards the two extremes of the political spectrum whilst the Lib Dems are continuing to be confused as to how to reclaim that middle ground.

The anti-Watson motion has been dropped, apparently after Corbyn intervened. Nevertheless, the fact that it was even tabled in such an underhand way does not look good.

Socialism polls well when people aren't given its name. The responsibility of socialists is to erase that negative and wrong association and focus on combating capitalist 'truths'. Some do that well, Ash Sarkar's being doing great with it recently to give an example. It can absolutely be the central ideology of a governing party - and the worst part of the last decades of British politics is that the Conservatives have done a great job of making that seem like an impossibility.

 

However the people involved in the core of Momentum are brazenly idiotic at times - like with this Tom Watson situation. Labour does need to be a broad church, as the people who feel they'll be represented by Labour's centrists are the ones that will be amenable to democratic socialism. You don't piss them off so you can enforce your power grab.

The anti-Watson motion has been dropped, apparently after Corbyn intervened. Nevertheless, the fact that it was even tabled in such an underhand way does not look good.

 

How so? BECAUSE OF A ONE PARTY STATE MEDIA MORE FIT FOR A DICTATORSHIP THAN A DEMOCRACY!!

 

Bojo the No Show can fire 21 Tories, Tory councillors, Churchill's pm, two ex chancellors, and his leaderhip rivals, and any advisor who disagrees with unelected beaurocrat Dominick Cumminga. Media: omg skweee strong leadership skweeew!! Labour: wants to fire someone from a deputy position ONLY, who attackd the party continuously and makes the party dip in the polls every single time he opens his mouth. Media: OMFG CIVIL WAR, STALINIST PUUURGE!!!!

Michael - you are speaking absolute rubbish and being toally hypocritical. How was Watson attacking the party? By saying we should have a referendum before a general election? I think that is the view of many people. Or is it the fact he is actively trying to work with other parties to prevent a national crisis? It's utter bollocks. He wasn't even tried to be fired, he was actively going to be removed by people who are not elected and have no control over the party. If you think Watson is the reason for dropping in the polls then you really are lost in the romantisisation of grassroots socialism.

 

Britian is not a socialist country waiting for a left wing leader to lead us to some sort of romanticised paradise. We are a complicated society of left and right wing opinions and a small Centrist Conversative middle ground. To get left wing policies in practice in a government you've got to compromise. I'll never fully understand the hate for Blair, so many people's lives changed for the better. He was not perfect, but who is.

Not that. He attacked it and contradicted it on multiple, multiple occasions.

 

And yet like Iz said, socialism is wildly popular and so are Corbyn's policies when stripped of their names. The only reason why the country is what it is? The extreme right media. They pushed the Overton window AND WILL KEEP PUSHING. What's right now will be left soon.

Socialism polls well when people aren't given its name. The responsibility of socialists is to erase that negative and wrong association and focus on combating capitalist 'truths'. Some do that well, Ash Sarkar's being doing great with it recently to give an example. It can absolutely be the central ideology of a governing party - and the worst part of the last decades of British politics is that the Conservatives have done a great job of making that seem like an impossibility.

 

However the people involved in the core of Momentum are brazenly idiotic at times - like with this Tom Watson situation. Labour does need to be a broad church, as the people who feel they'll be represented by Labour's centrists are the ones that will be amenable to democratic socialism. You don't piss them off so you can enforce your power grab.

 

Exactly this. People like to pretend they hate socialist policies and ideas purely because of the stigma attached to the word.

 

It doesn't take much to imagine how the media or the right would portray the invention of the NHS in 2019 — impossible, radical, socialist.

Edited September 21, 20197 yr by blacksquare