After Christina easily won the last battle, we go back a few years to 2000, one of the best years for #1s of all time.

 

In 2000, the two biggest UK girl bands of all time - and biggest in the world in the case of the Spices - were still going, but just barely. Whilst All Saints would scrape into 2001 and then split after releasing the wrong single, the Spices split in 2000 following one of the worst albums of all time. They soon realised that they had no singles left on the album, and so they shut up shop and officially went solo ... even though they were also solo in 2000, producing better songs and bigger hits than their parent band that year.

 

In October, the All Saints released their second and final no.1 from the album, Saints and Sinners. It got to no.1 for one week. It is regarded as one of the best pop tracks of all time. In November, the Spices released their final no.1 ever, Hollier/ Let Love (Lead The Way). It got to no.1 for week. It was knocked off by Westlife the week after, and they were lucky they did not release at the same time, as the nondescript cover sold more than their song, but not by much. Hollier/ LL(LTW) is considered as one of the most famous double A-side no.1s of all time, and Hollier is one of only two no.1s EVER to reference Star Trek, in Victoria's line, "And I won't energise". The Star Trek-inspired lyric was meant to match the futuristic new video and style of the band and match the futuristic feel of 2000. Also, the Spices were doubly lucky, too, with this release, as without a double A-side, they wouldn't have beaten Martine McCutchen to no.1 either!

 

The album releases came next. Forever was released during a much-publicised chart battle with Westlife. It ... was destroyed and barely scraped #2, showing that the band was over. Had it released one week earlier, it would have not dented the top 5! It is considered as one of the worst albums of all time, filled with boring, plodding rnb. Saints and Sinners hit no.1, unlike their first, and stayed at the summit for two weeks. It sold over 600,000 in total, around half of their debut, but they did not follow up promotion with other singles or do a tour, as they split in 2001. With more singles and a tour, it would likely have hit platinum. Critics were mixed, and most complained that the album was weak, aside from the William Orbit tracks, and that it sounded too much like the Spices' Forever. It is half-rnb, half-MOR.

 

If the album campaigns had continued, All Saints were going to release Surrender next, and then Dreams and then finally Ha Ha. The Spices only had a single option: If You Want To (Have Some Fun) (Something On Your Mind) (Are You Having Fun?) (Are You Having Fun?) (Wink, Wink, Nudge, Nudge). Whilst both tracks are CLEARLY too long and go on and ON and on WAY too much, think about how they would have sounded as shorter, single edits. Though it is true that the tracks needed some heavy editing, and you more than get the point of them three minutes in, let alone at the almost SIX minutes mark, those shorter single edits were basically confirmed. A radio edit of Surrender was already being sent to radio before the Saints split, and If You Wanna was sent to tv channels as a shorter edit as well.

 

So, which of the two final, winter no.1s in 2000 from the yuge 90s girl bands do you think was best? And which planned single do you think is better/ would have done better in the charts, the William Orbit-produced Surrender, or the rnb, If You Want To (Loads of Bracket Stuff)?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The second question is easy for me. Surrender, with a 3 minute radio edit, is faaar better than IYWTHSFSOYMWWNNAYHF. It was probably a comfortable top 5 - 1 top 1 for the band. In fact, I think all three future singles from the album would have easily gone top 5. However, the first question has me stumped. They are both top notch.

As much as I adore spice girls and love holler Black Coffee is the stronger song for me! The follow up single is easily IYWHSF though, a radio edit of it would have been brilliant.

There's a lot to unpack here, and as always, I'll take the bait x

 

 

[spice Girls] soon realised that they had no singles left on the album

I don't recall any of the girls alluding to this as being a reason for parting ways when they did?

 

 

[Holler] got to no.1 for week. It was knocked off by Westlife the week after, and they were lucky they did not release at the same time, as the nondescript cover sold more than their song, but not by much.

Believe it or not, 'My Love' is a Westlife original song.

 

 

Hollier/ LL(LTW) is considered as one of the most famous double A-side no.1s of all time

I'm not sure what makes a double A Side "famous" but personally I doubt it's one of the more notorious or remembered ones in the grand scheme of music history :thinking:

 

 

Hollier is one of only two no.1s EVER to reference Star Trek, in Victoria's line, "And I won't energise". The Star Trek-inspired lyric was meant to match the futuristic new video and style of the band and match the futuristic feel of 2000.

 

 

Also, the Spices were doubly lucky, too, with this release, as without a double A-side, they wouldn't have beaten Martine McCutchen to no.1 either!

They more than likely would have done. Spice Girls sold 106,000 copies vs. Martine's 65,500. That's a pretty significant 40,500 copies ahead of her.

 

We can only speculate what would have happened if they'd only released Holler or only released Let Love Lead the Way. However the majority of the push with this single was centred around Holler - that's the song radio heavily supported (it reached #2 on airplay - Martine's song peaked at #18), and Holler is also the song they performed more often. It's probably fair to say a lot of the sales Spice Girls' single achieved was down to Holler, so I dare say it would have still reached #1 if they'd just released Holler on its own. Can't really comment on Let Love Lead the Way's chances by itself because it didn't get much of the focus.

 

 

Forever [...] was destroyed and barely scraped #2, showing that the band was over. Had it released one week earlier, it would have not dented the top 5!

As far as I'm aware the sales information for the #3 album from that week isn't actually known, so it can't really be claimed that Forever scraped #2. For all we know it was significantly ahead.

 

Forever's sales at #2 were actually quite strong...

http://scans.chartarchive.org/UK/2000/UK%2...02000.11.18.pdf

"Although 73,000 is well down on the opening tallies of [the Spice Girls'] first two albums, it is the second highest sales opening for a number two album [in 2000], and is well ahead of the median figure for number one albums this year."

 

I don't think we know for sure about a week earlier. We know that Steps sold 77,000 to be #4, in an unusually high selling week, so Forever would have been no higher than #5 assuming it had sold the same amount. I don't think we have info about what the #5 album sold that week.

 

 

Saints and Sinners hit no.1 [and] stayed at the summit for two weeks.

Saints and Sinners spent 1 week at #1 - https://www.officialcharts.com/search/album...-_and_-sinners/

 

 

[saints and Sinners] sold over 600,000 in total, around half of their debut, but they did not follow up promotion with other singles or do a tour, as they split in 2001. With more singles and a tour, it would likely have hit platinum.

'All Hooked Up' was released as a single in January 2001, as a post album single - 3 months after the album's release - so promotion for the album did continue for a short time before their split. The album was certified 2xPlatinum in December 2000, due to 600,000+ units shipped to stores.

 

 

Critics were mixed, and most complained that [saints and Sinners] was weak, aside from the William Orbit tracks, and that it sounded too much like the Spices' Forever. It is half-rnb, half-MOR.

Saints and Sinners was released 3 weeks before Forever; I don't recall any comparisons being drawn between the two albums and it would have been unusual for critics to highlight an album that hadn't been released yet.

 

 

If the album campaigns had continued [...] The Spices only had a single option: If You Want To (Have Some Fun) (Something On Your Mind) (Are You Having Fun?) (Are You Having Fun?) (Wink, Wink, Nudge, Nudge).

Virgin Records were considering Tell Me Why, If You Wanna Have Some Fun and Weekend Love as future singles; promo singles were produced: http://ultimatespice.online.fr/spicegirls/...versubmenu.html

In summary, Meek's post is 100% accurate

In summary, Meek's post is 100% accurate

omg

You can't honestly believe they would have released a bad rnb song, or a lifeless ballad with a ... rap breakdown at the end for some reason, though.

Black Coffee by a country mile

You can't honestly believe they would have released a bad rnb song, or a lifeless ballad with a ... rap breakdown at the end for some reason, though

It’s a moot discussion point considering that other circumstances led to the Spice Girls calling it quits. But clearly from Virgin’s perspective, they thought those three songs had potential, to go ahead with promotional CDs/vinyl. Tell Me Why even has remixes.

Holler.

Surrender.

All Saints - Black Coffee - Easily gets my vote for the first poll, a stunning track with a wistful chorus, mellow production & an usual structure that gives the whole thing a cool eerie vibe. One of their best singles, a standout in their discography.

Spice Girls - If U Wanna Have Some Fun - This gets my vote in the 2nd poll, this could have easily been a hit in the early months of '01, not a chart topper though as nothing else on 'Forever' would have been #1. A firm top 5 hit for sure, in a radio edit form of course & along with a cool fun music video set in a nightclub with funky dance moves, that's how I picture the music video. Then the only other viable choice from 'Forever' as another single is 'Oxygen' to close out the era.

All Saints - Surrender is another nice track with a great dreamy sound & goes well with the first 2 singles (ignoring 'All Hooked Up') & could have fared well in a radio edit form as single #4. Also if there would have been a fifth single if this did well then my choices would have been either 'Dreams' or the criminally underrated 'One More Tequila'

'Black Coffee' is All Saints' best song evahhhhhh!

 

I'm gonna pick 'Surrender' out of the last two as well actually.

Spice Girls - If U Wanna Have Some Fun - this could have easily been a hit in the early months of '01, not a chart topper though as nothing else on 'Forever' would have been #1. A firm top 5 hit for sure

I mean, who knows what could have been? Had they continued, there were certainly some low-ish #1 sales weeks in 2001 that Spice Girls might have taken advantage of.

I finally went for All Saints for both :o If U Wanna is clearly the next best song on Forever, but it would have flopped. Surrender, with a radio edit, sounds like a top 3 and would have cemented their sound in pop history. Black Coffee is so magical and different to anything else that in the end it had to be that, but Hollier is a yuuuge bop too.

All .Saints on both polls for me.

Voted for All Saints on both but 'If U Wanna Have Some Fun' is alright too!

As much as I adore spice girls and love holler Black Coffee is the stronger song for me! The follow up single is easily IYWHSF though, a radio edit of it would have been brilliant.

 

Agree with all of this.