2 hours ago, Liam S said:

Well I mean your contributions tend to be wildly biased delulu. Didn’t you say you thought Trump and Elon illegally found a way to steal the election?

Judges in America are often politically biased and appointed by Presidents to their roles so you get some very sketchy judgements often overruled by different circuits.

Call me crazy but I tend to side with victims of bad people not bad people. The modern day human rights approach of punishing the victim twice and putting the rights of the criminal above all else is not something I have any time for though it’s very normalised in the UK.

As it happens Trump called for that judge to be impeached and a Supreme Court justice disagreed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j0vwpkwkxo

Stop constant cowardly deflecting and extrapolation to the entire population while catastrophising that does nothing but create fear and block any constructive dialogue. The mental gymnastics being done here are bat shit crazy, indeed.

11 hours ago, Liam S said:

Well I mean your contributions tend to be wildly biased delulu. Didn’t you say you thought Trump and Elon illegally found a way to steal the election?

Call me crazy but I tend to side with victims of bad people not bad people. The modern day human rights approach of punishing the victim twice and putting the rights of the criminal above all else is not something I have any time for though it’s very normalised in the UK.

As it happens Trump called for that judge to be impeached and a Supreme Court justice disagreed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j0vwpkwkxo

You calling anyone else wildly biased and saying you side with victims is the biggest 'delulu' I've seen on here in years, Mr "maybe the fascists have a point"...

As for the election, Trump was proven trying to cheat in 2016 and 2020, before partnering out of the blue with known tech magnate and social media manipulator Elon Musk for the 2024 run. He's since praised Musk for providing "voting machines" and won all the states he wasn't predicted to win.

Maybe he did or maybe he didn't cheat, but it would be out of character for him to suddenly try not to after literally attempting an illegal coup to stay in power before.

Can't wait to hear your take on January 6th.

Oh no, please don’t encourage lol, I already unfollowed this topic, it’s becoming unbearable to read it without being triggered (current news are already enough of a trigger).

Kudos to Rooney, Iz et al for having patience and actually providing useful info and engaging in the discussion in a constructive way.

20 hours ago, Liam S said:

Well I mean your contributions tend to be wildly biased delulu. Didn’t you say you thought Trump and Elon illegally found a way to steal the election?

Judges in America are often politically biased and appointed by Presidents to their roles so you get some very sketchy judgements often overruled by different circuits.

Call me crazy but I tend to side with victims of bad people not bad people. The modern day human rights approach of punishing the victim twice and putting the rights of the criminal above all else is not something I have any time for though it’s very normalised in the UK.

As it happens Trump called for that judge to be impeached and a Supreme Court justice disagreed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j0vwpkwkxo

My posts on the matter keep getting deleted, but you're talking about me. Let me briefly expñain:

1. Trump is a fascist. He started screaming about stolen elections ss soon as he lost. However, there was zero proof. He demanded that they "find" thoudands of votes for him. Therefore, he has no compunctions about cheating. Onto 2:

2. With Trump, he likes to accuse others of what he himself does in order to deflect. It would also take any teeth out of rumours of REPUBLICAN cheating in any future elections, as the ACTUAL CONSPIRACY THEORY that Trump parroted was so ridiculous thst it would make the other side look like the mirror image if they said something similar in the future. "Oh, now it's DEMS with conspiracy theories lol". With that, it is now impossible for Dems to talk about cheating.

3. So, knowing that, and knowing that he would GLADLY cheat.. is it so far-fetched that he would, at least, try?

4. Staticians started raising alarm bells about "statistical anomalies" the night of the election.

5. In a VERY CLOSE election, decided by a percentage point, how is it that NOT ONE ward, not s single one, moved blue? None. There was a UNIVERSAL, UNIFORM move towards Trump EVERYWHERE, and yet the numbers remained close. So, again. How did he get every swing state??

6. Bullet Ballots. Trump's margin of victory in 5 swing states was exactly in keeping with the number of bullet ballots -e.g, someone who votes president and nothin else.

7. There was a DIRECT inverse in states she lost, 1.1, exactly. If Trump gained 1%, she lost 1%. It was perfect statistically ... and very strange.

8. Trump started shouting about Elon "knowing those machines". Elon shouted about how it wss so easy to hack them; it just needed one line of code.

9. He won by just enough everywhere to avoid a manual recount.

10. Elon went to bed very early, long before results were tallied. He just texted Trump a thumbs up emoji.

AM I saying, or are we saying, that he DEFINITELY cheated? No. We are saying, however, that the numbers look ... suspicious, as do their words. We know fascists have no compunction to tell the truth, and no moral duty not to lie. A national, manual recount of ALL votes would end any speculation, of course, but we're just outside of manual recounts everywhere! If the manual recounts found nothing, we would accept it. It's not a conspiracy theory. It's not screaming that he DID something FOR SURE. It's just saying there are grounds to be suspicious.

59 minutes ago, Walford Whacker said:

My posts on the matter keep getting deleted, but you're talking about me. Let me briefly expñain:

1. Trump is a fascist. He started screaming about stolen elections ss soon as he lost. However, there was zero proof. He demanded that they "find" thoudands of votes for him. Therefore, he has no compunctions about cheating. Onto 2:

2. With Trump, he likes to accuse others of what he himself does in order to deflect. It would also take any teeth out of rumours of REPUBLICAN cheating in any future elections, as the ACTUAL CONSPIRACY THEORY that Trump parroted was so ridiculous thst it would make the other side look like the mirror image if they said something similar in the future. "Oh, now it's DEMS with conspiracy theories lol". With that, it is now impossible for Dems to talk about cheating.

3. So, knowing that, and knowing that he would GLADLY cheat.. is it so far-fetched that he would, at least, try?

4. Staticians started raising alarm bells about "statistical anomalies" the night of the election.

5. In a VERY CLOSE election, decided by a percentage point, how is it that NOT ONE ward, not s single one, moved blue? None. There was a UNIVERSAL, UNIFORM move towards Trump EVERYWHERE, and yet the numbers remained close. So, again. How did he get every swing state??

6. Bullet Ballots. Trump's margin of victory in 5 swing states was exactly in keeping with the number of bullet ballots -e.g, someone who votes president and nothin else.

7. There was a DIRECT inverse in states she lost, 1.1, exactly. If Trump gained 1%, she lost 1%. It was perfect statistically ... and very strange.

8. Trump started shouting about Elon "knowing those machines". Elon shouted about how it wss so easy to hack them; it just needed one line of code.

9. He won by just enough everywhere to avoid a manual recount.

10. Elon went to bed very early, long before results were tallied. He just texted Trump a thumbs up emoji.

AM I saying, or are we saying, that he DEFINITELY cheated? No. We are saying, however, that the numbers look ... suspicious, as do their words. We know fascists have no compunction to tell the truth, and no moral duty not to lie. A national, manual recount of ALL votes would end any speculation, of course, but we're just outside of manual recounts everywhere! If the manual recounts found nothing, we would accept it. It's not a conspiracy theory. It's not screaming that he DID something FOR SURE. It's just saying there are grounds to be suspicious.

I mean I wasn’t talking about you I was quoting the person Lol

As for the cheating I don’t see how you can mock the Jan 7 people and then turn into them.

It would be extremely difficult to cheat an election. There would be signs or evidence.

Recounts very rarely change anything, a few hundred votes at most. Elon created a script that predicted trends based on early data so it replicated results in a state after 10-15% of the vote was in. That’s why he knew or thought he knew earlier. TBH it was obvious. I even said on this forum Trump is gonna win every swing state before he even won 1 due to the early data.

The polls matched the result. The margins in irrelevant places matched the trends etc. it’s a pretty bizarre belief when all evidence strongly points the other way. You have to be forcing yourself to believe something that doesn’t make sense. It’s delulu land. Nobody out there is the political world is alleging or suggesting this. So it’s more a fringe biased wacky view akin to the storming the capital people just from another direction🤷‍♂️

The only time an election was stolen was 2004 and it wasn’t stolen in some sophisticated way. It was in plain sight. And that’s really the only way to steal an election. Everything else is just usually people unable to accept reality so making it what they want it to be instead.

3 minutes ago, Liam S said:

I mean I wasn’t talking about you I was quoting the person Lol

As for the cheating I don’t see how you can mock the Jan 7 people and then turn into them.

It would be extremely difficult to cheat an election. There would be signs or evidence.

Recounts very rarely change anything, a few hundred votes at most. Elon created a script that predicted trends based on early data so it replicated results in a state after 10-15% of the vote was in. That’s why he knew or thought he knew earlier. TBH it was obvious. I even said on this forum Trump is gonna win every swing state before he even won 1 due to the early data.

The polls matched the result. The margins in irrelevant places matched the trends etc. it’s a pretty bizarre belief when all evidence strongly points the other way. You have to be forcing yourself to believe something that doesn’t make sense. It’s delulu land. Nobody out there is the political world is alleging or suggesting this. So it’s more a fringe biased wacky view akin to the storming the capital people just from another direction🤷‍♂️

The only time an election was stolen was 2004 and it wasn’t stolen in some sophisticated way. It was in plain sight. And that’s really the only way to steal an election. Everything else is just usually people unable to accept reality so making it what they want it to be instead.

I point you back to my second point in response to this :) Trump's extreme narcissism and attacks on democracy have, suprirse surprise, resulted in eroded trust OF ssid democracy. The fact that he accuses others of what he does, screams about a nonsense conspiracy, and then suspicious results crop up later... No Democrat COULD contest these results due to point 2. You sre proving thid point btw. And, again, it is different. There are major statistical anomalies and a fascist billionaire - sorry, two - working with the campaign. Again, we're NOT saying they DID cheat, unlile the 2020 lot - we're saying something looks strsnge about it. If they had stolen the election, manual recountd would prove it, as tjose bullet ballots would not actuslly exist. They went uo from below 1% in every other election, ever, in the US to well over 8% and up BUT JUST in swing states. In other states, they went uo slightly, matching a uniform swing. Not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE, but it is strange.

2000, not 2004, wasn't exactly stolen... The hanging chads statistics aren't so clesr cut. What IS more clear cut is them purging 500k likely Democrstic voters just before the election. But that's voter suppression. If Republicans were more popular, that wouldn't be needed btw.

22 hours ago, Liam S said:

Well I mean your contributions tend to be wildly biased delulu. Didn’t you say you thought Trump and Elon illegally found a way to steal the election?

Judges in America are often politically biased and appointed by Presidents to their roles so you get some very sketchy judgements often overruled by different circuits.

Call me crazy but I tend to side with victims of bad people not bad people. The modern day human rights approach of punishing the victim twice and putting the rights of the criminal above all else is not something I have any time for though it’s very normalised in the UK.

As it happens Trump called for that judge to be impeached and a Supreme Court justice disagreed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j0vwpkwkxo

Trump himelf made comments which indicated that Elon had helped him win which is just like the typical egostical behaviour of that asshole. I honestly don't think you're in a position to call anyone else biased and delulu.

34 minutes ago, Walford Whacker said:

I point you back to my second point in response to this :) Trump's extreme narcissism and attacks on democracy have, suprirse surprise, resulted in eroded trust OF ssid democracy. The fact that he accuses others of what he does, screams about a nonsense conspiracy, and then suspicious results crop up later... No Democrat COULD contest these results due to point 2. You sre proving thid point btw. And, again, it is different. There are major statistical anomalies and a fascist billionaire - sorry, two - working with the campaign. Again, we're NOT saying they DID cheat, unlile the 2020 lot - we're saying something looks strsnge about it. If they had stolen the election, manual recountd would prove it, as tjose bullet ballots would not actuslly exist. They went uo from below 1% in every other election, ever, in the US to well over 8% and up BUT JUST in swing states. In other states, they went uo slightly, matching a uniform swing. Not saying it's IMPOSSIBLE, but it is strange.

2000, not 2004, wasn't exactly stolen... The hanging chads statistics aren't so clesr cut. What IS more clear cut is them purging 500k likely Democrstic voters just before the election. But that's voter suppression. If Republicans were more popular, that wouldn't be needed btw.

The one with Al Gore whatever year that was.

Your evidence of election theft cannot be Trump being a narcissist or accusing people of things because this is just evidence you think he would cheat if he could not evidence he actually cheated.

These statistical anomalies seem plucked from your own imagination. There were very few anomalies if any. Everything was pretty consistent. Trump even gained a lot in places like New York. Nothing looks dodgy at all.

You’re telling me the Democrats the people who invented various conspiracies from tapes Putin has on Trump to blackmail him and impeached him etc wouldn’t bring up a clear case of stealing an election? Of course they would.

Elon who is someone derided as overrated and not as intelligent or innovative as claimed suddenly was able to outsmart the whole system? Because he’s a billionaire? Isn’t Bill Gates a billionaire? Didn’t Kamala raise 1 billion? How has Elon outsmarted everybody? There aren’t tech geniuses on the Democratic side? They couldn’t figure out how Elon did it?? They had billionaires and a billion in cash and more activists everywhere but couldn’t find one instance of cheating? Not adding up my friend.

Besides. Arizona hand count everything so Elon would have had to somehow steal an election everywhere else(the evidence for this being Trump said he’s good with computers LOL) then also corrupted the hand count in Arizona.

Of course the % went up more in swing states, that’s where they campaigned. If the trend was Trump gaining everywhere it makes sense he gained the most where he campaigned the most. There is no case for a stolen election except in your wildest dreams. It’s beyond cognitive dissonance to think Elon is capable of doing that undetected while also thinking he’s a clown fascist running twitter and Tesla into the ground.

I don’t know about purges I think they were to stop illegals voting, anybody who wanted to vote could vote except illegals and maybe making it harder for illegals to vote cost the Dems some votes

It's not cognitive dissonance to think Elon is capable of things unless you're conflating two meanings of the word down into one.

Elon is a very rich man. While he might not personally be capable in the sense of having the mental and inventive capacity to personally do magical things with technology, he does due to his immense wealth have the financial capacity to pay other people (who are legally bound by NDAs etc. or by other means of control he has over them) to do all kinds of things on his behalf, and further he has the moral capacity to order people to do all kinds of things that might be immoral or illegal as long as he benefits.

I just wish he'd decided to get that submarine.

It’s just baseless nonsense. This guy I don’t like is really rich I’m just going to run with a wild conspiracy where he’s scoured the dark web for geniuses then gagged them with NDA’s not to reveal how they fixed the election. I’m sure an NDA for election rigging would hold up in court 🤦‍♂️😫

Other means of control? Elon has gone from a nerdish fascist to the mafia🤨

Ultimately both claims from two people come down to I think they’re evil and lack morals so they would definitely rig an election so I’m just going to assume they did. This is just unrealistic and biased. This is real life not a movie.

Elon used his money to transport Amish, pump ads, pay activists and obviously that’s all normal, legal and helped. The rest is for the birds. A guy worth hundreds of billions is not risking his freedom and fortune for a four year election. Billionaires are fine either way. ✌️

I mean, I agree, I prefer to stick to the facts and there is no evidence of any wide-scale vote rigging in the 2024 election, and left-wing people who insist there was, a thankfully small number, lose the high ground a bit from Trump's couping lot from Jan 6.

What is undeniable though is that Elon poured a lot of money into helping Trump get elected, as well as basically swing the central operating apparatus of a large social media site into campaigning for him, which is somewhat against the spirit if not the rules of fair elections and coming from a UK political background with strict campaigning spending limits, has me pretty aghast. The common argument is that 'he's a private citizen', but most private citizens do not have the resources to spend so much, and he seems unique among billionaires in his recent obsession (without too much psychoanalysis, getting divorced and clearly being narcissistic has helped this), plus even the biggest donors normally don't tend to end up with huge roles in the resulting administration which adds to the feeling that he bought it.

It's a problem with American media in general, they're slavish towards their ideological benefactors without holding truth to power in the way European broadcast media tends to, and they essentially turn regular consumers of their media content into electoral zombies.

But really, far better use of energy to look towards what's next and in America that seems to be a choice between Schumer's defeatism and inability to grasp the scale of the problem

Tim Walz is doing a decent set of town halls though, he's clearly doing his best to set himself out as a leader of some kind within the Democratic party, which they sorely need.

also re the above clip, lel

Trump is eliminating the Department Of Education.

but worry not, I'm sure there'll be a reasonable explanation for why the Republicans want to fuck up the education of American students any minute now.

Imagine being the kind of person who would say "I'm sure there's a perfectly valid reason for this, it's paranoid to think someone that's at no point in their life shown themself to have any morals whatsoever and had at multiple turns when presented with a kind option and a cruel option deliberately chosen the cruel option, could be a bad person" right up until the point they lock you in with the firing squad.

You should be more sceptical for your own good Liam. And that goes for anyone who isn't too.

I'm sorry to say this but this to an extent comes down to experience, if you've experienced cruelty and discrimination directed at you by someone who has power over you and the will to be hurtful to satisfy themselves before, or if you haven't. Once upon a time I believed the best of people too. Now, unfortunately, I'm cautious, and when somebody starts exhibiting behaviour that suggests they won't abide by normal rules of engagement, that tends to bear out in the kind of person they are and the kind of things they will think nothing of doing.

37 minutes ago, Iz 🌟 said:

Trump is eliminating the Department Of Education.

but worry not, I'm sure there'll be a reasonable explanation for why the Republicans want to f*** up the education of American students any minute now.

Based on the comments of many Americans, it's hard to believe they have an education system.

i feel like I’m living in a weird mix of Fahrenheit 451 and 1984 and as someone who teaches math I’m going to lose it if people start saying math is too woke

Can't wait to see how Biden gets the blame for this.

On the one hand you have them unironically having a 'Strikes in Yemen 👊🇺🇲💥' groupchat on a public application, and then someone within that group of bright sparks decides to add a journalist to it...

I'm sure anyone who's worked in a corporate setting will know to keep discussions around business to company-approved applications (which always made it hilarious whenever the odd Tory Whatsapp story was leaked), so I would think that goes many orders of magnitude more for people at the top of the most powerful military in the world. If they weren't idiotic amateurs.

Saw that Vance had another go at Europe in private too - if we needed any more proof that this administration isn't a friend of Western democracy.

Both the couch f***er and the drunk had pot shots at Europe. I like that we live rent free in their heads

f*** the new world!!

Uppa old world!!