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EU/Brexit Discussion Thread III

Brett-Butler
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Airbus intends to move from the UK, taking it's EU subsidies to help UK business and stuffing it. This hits all of the suppliers as well as the direct jobs and 1.7 billion in tax directly lost.

 

The Times headlines this with the wonderful co-headlining news that fruit-picking is a marvellous job. Great news for unemployed skilled engineers then - getting by on hard graft on shit money so supermarkets can demand low prices for British goods.

 

We can sell our brains and expertise, Brexiters scream, who needs industry!!!

 

Well, Indians and Chinese citizens are just as smart and there's more of them, and they work for less money.

 

Project Fear! Fake News! Don't care if we crash n burn! It's what people voted for they all knew it would destroy their jobs! It said so on the referendum voting sheet! Kick all those whinging business owners out the country!!

 

ahhhh happy days ahead.

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In more canet make it up, the Home Office sent leaflets to WELSH MPs advising them on how to avoid deportation after Brexit!! :lol:

 

Little England has lost the plot. It really does mean to be a One Party State of a single nation after Brexit.

Interesting that the last political party to storm out of the commons (as per the SNP the other week) were the Liberal Democrats back in 2008: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7265516.stm

 

... and the reason for this stunt, ah yes - a request for debate on 'a referendum to be held on the UK's membership of the EU.' !! How times change..

Just to help everyone appreciate Farage racism, hypocrisy and lies here's a great 2014 interview where he gets annihilated by the fab James O'Brien in a way that 99% of journalists don't bother trying because they don't know the facts.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/m...MP=share_btn_tw

 

NOTE: the fascist parties he denounces he is now aligned with. Who could have predicted such a thing!?

MPs are not delegates. They are obliged to act in the interests of the country. Given that most MPs voted Remain, they are acting against their own code of conduct.

 

ISTM that 'code of conduct' creates a conflict of interest then, as they are supposed to be representing the people who voted for them.

 

There was nothing on the referendum sheet that I noticed which said a single thing about giving up Parliamentary accountability as a "Thing" nor were there details on what Brexit meant, nor were the people happily telling us lies at any stage telling us that Brexit meant a Hard Brexit and a huge blow to the economy - as they do now.

 

It's a wonder all you Remainers aren't lottery millionaires, given good you are at apparently predicting the future... :rolleyes:

 

Give examples. I can't think of any major lefty drivel policies that are so inhuman and appalling that it makes people turn to racism and lies to justify getting rid of them, but I look forward to examples and being educated.

 

I will provide my examples only if you promise not to dismiss them out-of-hand as 'Mail propaganda'.

 

Labour voters poll - 72% think Brexit is a bad idea. Corbyn remains aloof from his voter base and core supporters.

 

I thought you *liked* politicians to follow their consciences?

ISTM that 'code of conduct' creates a conflict of interest then, as they are supposed to be representing the people who voted for them.

It's a wonder all you Remainers aren't lottery millionaires, given good you are at apparently predicting the future... :rolleyes:

I will provide my examples only if you promise not to dismiss them out-of-hand as 'Mail propaganda'.

I thought you *liked* politicians to follow their consciences?

 

As Suedey keeps reminding you Brexit was a concept, not a fixed set of facts, and it was advisory. The public was lied to about what it meant. Full stop.

 

We are apparently f***ing psychic compared to the Brexit politicians who are threatening the EU with economic damage and no deal today (HI Dr Liam Werrity Private Deceitful Deals On British Government Deals) completely oblivious as they always have been that the economic damage to the UK will be hugely f***ing worse than it would be to the EU. Blackmail doesn't work with the EU, 2 years on and the blinkered fools still havent grasped that in the shitshow that continues to be the Brexit Moron Liars.

 

Examples that are backed up by facts are not propaganda. If you can't find any facts then it's lies or opinion based on nothing. Up to you which route you go. You consistently don't find anything to support your opinion though so I'm guessing the latter....as usual.

 

I gave no opinion on Corbyn's morality, however any party leader who ignores his voter base and his MP's and his core adoring fanbase over an issue that became an issue cos he deliberately did the bare minimum he could get away with is not in my opinion worthy of the job. Had May been following her original beliefs and insisted on not a Hard Brexit (she was a Remainer, supposedly) then you would be apoplectic by now....

 

In other words MP's can follow their conscience, but leaders of the party have to follow their core voter base on vital issues. In the case of the Tories they are clearly split down the middle on Brexit, in the case of Labour they aren't.

As Suedey keeps reminding you Brexit was a concept, not a fixed set of facts, and it was advisory. The public was lied to about what it meant. Full stop.

 

Doesn't that suggest the voters are relatively blameless, and thet the campaigners are the ones who should carry the can?

 

Examples that are backed up by facts are not propaganda. If you can't find any facts then it's lies or opinion based on nothing. Up to you which route you go. You consistently don't find anything to support your opinion though so I'm guessing the latter....as usual.
Opinions do not necessarily need to be backed up by facts (although I consider mine to have sufficient basis), as they are are part of a person's belief system. In this respect they are like religious beliefs - not scientifically provable, but nonetheless valid to those who believe in them.

 

I gave no opinion on Corbyn's morality, however any party leader who ignores his voter base and his MP's and his core adoring fanbase over an issue that became an issue cos he deliberately did the bare minimum he could get away with is not in my opinion worthy of the job. Had May been following her original beliefs and insisted on not a Hard Brexit (she was a Remainer, supposedly) then you would be apoplectic by now....

 

In other words MP's can follow their conscience, but leaders of the party have to follow their core voter base on vital issues. In the case of the Tories they are clearly split down the middle on Brexit, in the case of Labour they aren't.

 

Are you talking MP's, or their ordinary supporters?

 

Doesn't that suggest the voters are relatively blameless, and thet the campaigners are the ones who should carry the can?

 

Opinions do not necessarily need to be backed up by facts (although I consider mine to have sufficient basis), as they are are part of a person's belief system. In this respect they are like religious beliefs - not scientifically provable, but nonetheless valid to those who believe in them.

Are you talking MP's, or their ordinary supporters?

 

1. Not all Brexit voters are to be blamed for anything other than gullibility, which is something to feel sorry for them having trusting natures. Trusting people are nice people. The w*n**rs who take advantage of them are the hateful ones.

 

2. Yes they do. The sky is blue. You choosing to believe it's purple as an act of faith or belief is your right, but that doesn't make it true, nor does it mean the rest of us have to accept the possibility that the sky isnt blue because some deluded people wish to believe it's purple. Some things are absolute, and people constantly prove that they are open to believing anything. Absolutely anything, despite 100% proof to the contrary. So those views have to be disregarded in the real world. If you can't provide evidence that something is true then saying it is true is a sign of delusion or dishonesty. The best you can offer is that "I THINK I am right, but I can't prove it". If you start repeating soundbites that are clearly nonsense then other people are completely right to point out that those aren't facts, they are either OPINION or LIES, depending on which category they fall into.

 

3. I clearly said both.

"@JamesCrisp6

Exclusive: "F*** business"

EU diplomats shocked by Boris Johnson's 'four-letter reply' to business's Brexit fears at Foreign Office reception for Queen's birthday.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/0...iness-concerns/ …"

 

 

 

"@Dorianlynskey

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Dorian Lynskey Retweeted James Crisp

The modern Brexit-maddened Tory party in a nutshell. They’re not conservative, they’re not unionist, they’re not pro-business. What’s left except English jingoism?Dorian Lynskey added,

James Crisp

"

Boris thinking Hard Brexit means he gets to shag everyone in the country while they prostitute their bodies to make a living and keep food on the table while he and his rich European-moved-business pals rake in the dosh.

 

The only soft toilet roll on display is between Johnson's wife-cheating, serial-lying, power-mad, callous ears.

 

Floppy hair, quoting classic latin and archaic words while shuffling shiftily and aimlessly in your job just shows a disturbing personality, not someone to be admired in any way whatsoever. Even his own sister and father disagree with him....

I saw something on twitter today that someone close to the EU Brexit negotiations said it’ll take us 10 years to leave, 10 years for non-millennials and Gen-Zers to realise it was a utter f*** up and 10 years for us to rejoin on worse terms.
I saw something on twitter today that someone close to the EU Brexit negotiations said it’ll take us 10 years to leave, 10 years for non-millennials and Gen-Zers to realise it was a utter f*** up and 10 years for us to rejoin on worse terms.

 

You consider Twitter a reliable source. :lol:

 

You consider Twitter a reliable source. :lol:

 

It was a re-tweet of an article quoting an EU UK minister involved in the process. So that's a fair OPINION I think. At least as fair as Liam Fox who isn't involved in the process at all, he's busy making us fab deals across the world like...errr...y'now, the one he just agreed...errrr

Thought it would be nice to have the point of view of an immigrant working in this country to the Daily Mail "3.8m criminals given British Status" front page headline propaganda (I have reworded it to reflect on the implication rather than the actual fact that the Tories agree people living here by right can stay, even if they have to pay hundreds of millions collectively to prove they arent criminals):

 

 

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"@luchinlucho

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So sick of this f***ing rhetoric.

 

We pay our taxes, teach your undergrads, fix your boilers, care for your sick, pick your produce, etc and we are damn good at it.

 

I believe the words you’re looking for are ‘thank you’."

 

Thank you.

Here's a good summary of the Tory Brexit:

 

"Hilary Benn

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@hilarybennmp

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Two years after the EU referendum what do we know?

1. The promises of the ‘easiest trade deal in history’, ‘we will hold all the cards’, ‘the exact same benefits’ and ‘no deal is better than a bad deal’ have all foundered on the rock of reality

2. The Cabinet is still arguing over what kind of customs arrangements it wants with the EU

3. There is no workable proposal yet to avoid a hard border in Northern Ireland

4. British businesses exporting to the EU don't know what to plan for which is why many support the UK remaining in a customs union

5. We still have no idea what our future relationship will be on security, foreign policy, data, approval of medicines and consumer safety

6. The public think it's all going very badly

7. There isn’t a majority in the House of Commons for a No Deal Brexit

8. Management by the Prime Minister in the party interest has taken precedence over leadership in the national interest

9. We are going to need a further transition period because so much time has been wasted (see 8. above)

10. Parliament must - and will - have the final say on the Brexit deal."

 

Wonder if Jezza has seen this....

Here's a good summary of the Tory Brexit:

 

"Hilary Benn

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@hilarybennmp

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<snip>

 

Wonder if Jezza has seen this....

 

I wonder if HB would have said this if his old man were still around? :thinking:

I wonder if HB would have said this if his old man were still around? :thinking:

He's a grown man, so I suspect he would have said the same. I'm pretty sure he voted in favour of the Iraq war.

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