It isn’t really public knowledge though is it? I’m sure people in the industry know it like we know it, but I don’t think there’s an official document anywhere confirming that they aren’t counted. I was thrown out of a Stop Ladbaby Facebook group last Christmas and called a saboteur for saying people were wasting their time streaming on the Thursday and should download instead LMAO. But it occurred to me that there wasn’t even an official source I could use to back up what I knew.

I think it’s been confirmed by Music Week but I don’t think the OCC have ever acknowledged it. I don’t recall any other news outlets like the BBC mentioning it either.

 

They are chart ineligible. The rules were changed after Oasis and later Blur ('Country House'), occupied two chart places with the same record in 1995. The chart rules state:

Ah I see, thank you!

It isn’t really public knowledge though is it? I’m sure people in the industry know it like we know it, but I don’t think there’s an official document anywhere confirming that they aren’t counted. I was thrown out of a Stop Ladbaby Facebook group last Christmas and called a saboteur for saying people were wasting their time streaming on the Thursday and should download instead LMAO. But it occurred to me that there wasn’t even an official source I could use to back up what I knew.

 

I'm not sure, is it in some small print somewhere under lock and key maybe?

 

I figure it could very quickly become public knowledge if a high enough profile trip up happened to expose it. Like if Taylor settled on a Thursday release for a lead single (she wouldn't), it broke all imaginable streaming records that day but had no presence on the Friday chart. Her fans would be incensed I'm sure.

 

Not that I have a solution for it, apart from pushing the chart back to a Saturday to ensure all data is in. I feel a bit for the OCC on this one though - the fact that Spotify etc can't report data on time is still crazy in this day and age.

Edited November 3, 20231 yr by gooddelta

The format rules for singles were introduced to reduce pressure on labels to have to fill multiple formats of singles with extra tracks, at cost to record labels when singles were largely loss leaders. Some labels also complained that other labels and acts had an advantage in being able to release multiple formats of singles as they could afford it. This unfair advantage was believed to be reflected in higher chart positions as fans bought all formats of a release. These rules were drawn up in the physical sales age but have continued to this day.

 

The albums market wasn't seen to have problems in quite the same way though chart rules did at one time restrict how albums could have sales combined. Live versions of albums, remix album and deluxe versions all had times when sales couldn't be combined with the original (live albums continue to have this restriction). But multiple formats of the same basic album were allowed because at one time they would normally be sold at full price and not discounted in week one as singles were. The problems that existed with singles could be said to now apply to albums but given how poor physical album sales are I doubt the OCC would seek to have restrictions imposed on how many formats could be released.

 

I assume the limiting of formats for singles back in the day was as they were cheaper there was more chance of fans buying multiple copies and manipulating the charts. Which is basically what fans do now with the album chart.

 

The OCC must have deliberately changed or are ignoring rules for albums now though as Tori Amos American Doll Posse album the deluxe version was not counted as it was deemed too good value for money with the extras it came with and thus not count towards her sales. Now albums come with all sorts of extras, signed cards and so on and are reduced to really cheap prices week of release too yet still count.

 

I think the lack of logical consistency is what many chart nerds hate with the OCC.

 

Perhaps some streaming platforms have different data collection days around the world and maybe their week starts on a Thursday instead of a Friday.

I’m sure there is a good reason why APPLE decided on a UK release on a Thursday.

I wouldn't be surprised if the OCC decide to conveniently forget about the format rule for this tbh. Not like they've had any reason to invoke it for quite some time before this.

If it made the difference between the Beatles going to #1 I wouldn't be surprised if they junk or tweak the physical format rule either. It's not as important as it was 30 years ago. I'm thinking Bowie impact on instant grat rules.

 

 

I don’t understand why the OCC allow artists to release 20+ formats and variations for albums and don’t bat at eyelid (to the point of even allowing minidiscs to count!), yet have stopped 99p signed singles counting and limit formats to 3.

Edited November 3, 20231 yr by ___∆___

Another chart rule to consider.

 

On 4/12/2010 a Beatles box set consisting of Beatles 1962-1966 and Beatles 1967-1970 entered the Top 100 albums charts at no. 59.

Will the 2023 4 CD box set and the 6 LP box set be combined as a re-entry, and added to the above chart run of 5 weeks?

 

The OCC would hardly divide sales by 2 and add them to the individual Red and Blue albums?

Video is out now and is an event all in itself so imagine that will add another ton of 'sales'

Where did all these votes for #1 suddenly come from :thinking:

...actually since the poll is to "predict the chart entry position", those 10 people who voted top 100 may end up with the bragging rights after all :lol:

Beatles are no. 1 on Official Singles Downloads Chart.

Beatles are no. 1 on Official Singles Downloads Chart.

#42 on the official chart!

...actually since the poll is to "predict the chart entry position", those 10 people who voted top 100 may end up with the bragging rights after all :lol:

well done to those ten correct predictors then!!

I’ve seen a few Billboard chart predictors on Twitter suggest that it might get to #1 over there too!

Well, it wasn't its debut position, but it ended up charting at #1 in the UK!

 

Its interesting to see all the lower predictions for it now.

Top 10 thanks to massive physical sales.

 

Many of us probably thought this was the best case scenario.

 

To realise that they'd have still gone to number 1 this week without selling a single physical copy is absolutely astonishing!

As a big fan I didn’t want to get my hopes up! But this is still more than I ever could’ve imagined. Glad there was so much goodwill for this release 💖

Good thing I didn't write my prediction so I can't look like an idiot on this occasion :basil: (iirc I voted for top 10 in the poll, but in retrospect I feel like it should have been obvious that inevitably strong physical sales combined with at least moderately decent streaming would make this a pretty strong contender for #1 when the bar is so low right now, though much less obvious that it'd do so well on downloads and streaming that it wouldn't have even needed the physical release).

Definitely exceeded my expectations.