No, but the public service pay increase was overdue and enough to bring it in line with where it probably should be - isn't really an indication of stimulating the economy to grow it... as of yet. I am expecting the budget to be very much austerity-driven though.

 

Agree that now is the time to make harsh choices, there's a chance of them having a payoff by the time of the next election.

 

Agreed the public sectors pay increases are the right thing to do, obviously costly but will boost productivity & the economy. I agree with others who speculated the 2nd NI cut was a trap set by the Tories for Labour. Think a small tax rise is the easiest way but it's not gonna happen and I totally get why. Seems they're going to go after capital gains, inhertitance and who knows maybe businesses too.

 

The budget is obviously going to be terrible, be interesting to see what choices are made.

I'm seeing Starmer getting a lot of criticism on reddit and iI'm not really sure why? I also don't understand why the subreddit for Labour UK is so out and out critical when... that's your team, guys.

Without being massively all over it, I feel Starmer is getting some unfair flack.

 

Perhaps his speech today wasn't very positive, but he's still having to clean up the mess made by the previous government. That's going to take time.

 

I'm seeing Starmer getting a lot of criticism on reddit and iI'm not really sure why? I also don't understand why the subreddit for Labour UK is so out and out critical when... that's your team, guys.

 

Most likely the Corbyn fanistas. I think some of the criticism is fair and valid, the Governent have got to be held to account but I think the decisions they are making at the moment are largely sensible.

I think so too! It's not my party but I don't understand criticism for criticism's sake. People need to be realistic.

I'm seeing Starmer getting a lot of criticism on reddit and iI'm not really sure why? I also don't understand why the subreddit for Labour UK is so out and out critical when... that's your team, guys.

 

Six months ago I'd have said that yeah, the less reasonable among the Labour left had held those subs hostage, but mainline UK reddits are seeing an uptick in right-wing accounts that thrive on rage bait and we now have a change of government, so I can't admonish the Labour subs too much, particularly as they're now in a position where they should be getting what they wanted.

 

Particularly as things like this are starting to come out:

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/202...?srnd=undefined

 

Rather than seeking legislation for the “right to switch off,” ministers instead will push for a code of practice for businesses, according to people familiar with the matter who asked not to be named.

 

We spend all this time waiting for a government on the side of the worker, and then we get one that melts in the face of any opposition to businesses.

 

Starmer's approval rating also falling to -16%.

Don’t really understand people defending Starmer. He promised change yet is not delivering any. He promised a fully costed manifesto as people hate politicians saying one thing and doing another yet has has already screwed over pensioners and now raising taxes. He really is out of his depth and you can see it too. He kind of got the Labour job by default and then win the election by default. The sleaze is all over the place still, putting people in positions they have no business in, letting donors get wild privileges. He’s just the exact same as before under a different name except no principles at all. At least the Tories had some principles you could trust them on. This guy stands for nothing. I wouldn’t say I was duped since I never rated him or voted for him but you could never foresee he would be this bad where I’d now prefer Sunak. Very depressing state of affairs. Liberal Democrats need to get their act together as they seem to only be relevant during elections but you never hear anything from them otherwise. Beginning to think Britain might benefit from coalition governments instead of giving too much power to too few people.

And these principles that you claim the last Tory government held? Are they in the room with us right now?

How much change could we have feasibly expected by now? August is a bit of a dead month for politics anyway.

That's kind of where I am. Having said that, hands up and say that I'm not a left leftwing person so that informs my bias.

 

Idk, I don't follow politics suuuuper closely but as someone who isn't particularly informed there's nothing that Starmer has done so far that insults me, in fact he has handled the 'riots' aka violent outbreak in the country remarkably swiftly. He ran on a centre left platform that was going to be more competent than the Tories and planned to take action and get things done, and he has.

Yeah I'd agree with you- there wasn't anything exciting or transformative promised in that election campaign beyond 'competence' and getting rid of the Tories. Many were fed up with the constant drama (yes, I'll be honest I do enjoy some drama- but it was getting ridiculous), chaos and uncertainty and simply wanted to not have to think about politics all the time. Therefore ppl were prepared to vote for an alternative, not matter how uninspiring, just to put an end to the chaos.

I'm no fan of Starmer at all but I have very few complaints about how he has governed since coming to power - just compare it to the same period Liz Truss was in power in Sep/Oct '22. I think he has handled a difficult first few weeks reasonably well (apart from when he removed the whip of some recalcitrant MPs) and I think we just have to accept that change will be slow.

 

It's frustrating because I worry this cautious and slow approach will drive more apathy and/or populism, but I actually feel so much happier knowing that we do have better decisions being made even if they aren't the policies or transformative changes that I feel we deeply need.

Yeah I'd agree with you- there wasn't anything exciting or transformative promised in that election campaign beyond 'competence' and getting rid of the Tories. Many were fed up with the constant drama (yes, I'll be honest I do enjoy some drama- but it was getting ridiculous), chaos and uncertainty and simply wanted to not have to think about politics all the time. Therefore ppl were prepared to vote for an alternative, not matter how uninspiring, just to put an end to the chaos.

I'm no fan of Starmer at all but I have very few complaints about how he has governed since coming to power - just compare it to the same period Liz Truss was in power in Sep/Oct '22. I think he has handled a difficult first few weeks reasonably well (apart from when he removed the whip of some recalcitrant MPs) and I think we just have to accept that change will be slow.

 

It's frustrating because I worry this cautious and slow approach will drive more apathy and/or populism, but I actually feel so much happier knowing that we do have better decisions being made even if they aren't the policies or transformative changes that I feel we deeply need.

 

Well put DB, your latter statement is my worry too. I feel Starmer's Labour are banking on things looking better in 3-4 years time, but who knows what the polls may say by then. Undoubtedly populism is coming for us fuelled by Reform and depending on what path the Tories take, who knows. I think we can take positives over how quickly the far-right were shut down despite making a large impact on social media, but I know many people can be influenced in to voting for an alternative because of some soundbites and Facebook advertising. Would like to think the Labour strategiests are thinking well ahead of this, but whether tit ends up convincing the elctorate is another matter.

Yeah I'd agree with you- there wasn't anything exciting or transformative promised in that election campaign beyond 'competence' and getting rid of the Tories. Many were fed up with the constant drama (yes, I'll be honest I do enjoy some drama- but it was getting ridiculous), chaos and uncertainty and simply wanted to not have to think about politics all the time. Therefore ppl were prepared to vote for an alternative, not matter how uninspiring, just to put an end to the chaos.

I'm no fan of Starmer at all but I have very few complaints about how he has governed since coming to power - just compare it to the same period Liz Truss was in power in Sep/Oct '22. I think he has handled a difficult first few weeks reasonably well (apart from when he removed the whip of some recalcitrant MPs) and I think we just have to accept that change will be slow.

 

It's frustrating because I worry this cautious and slow approach will drive more apathy and/or populism, but I actually feel so much happier knowing that we do have better decisions being made even if they aren't the policies or transformative changes that I feel we deeply need.

 

Agreed!

 

I think he's done well for the most part, although the winter fuel allowance is the one big mis-step. I am hoping that we'll see that either reigned in or U-turned on when we get the budget.

 

You can't really expect instant changes from a government which has yet to reveal a budget. Particularly as after the election came the parliament summer recess, so very little would be done except appointing of people and announcing various things to come in the budget.

 

I have noticed the right wing bots out in more force though which is frustrating.

 

I'm hopeful that with the slightly better than expected economic outlook that there will be more wiggle room in the budget for things such as the winter fuel allowance.

Another genius move from Starmer now banning smoking areas outside pubs, is it a distraction or is he really introducing a policy nobody supports for no reason whatsoever god only knows with him

 

Another genius move from Starmer now banning smoking areas outside pubs, is it a distraction or is he really introducing a policy nobody supports for no reason whatsoever god only knows with him

Anything he does will be unpopular with someone. I don't know if "nobody" is applicable here.

 

I don't smoke nor go to pubs so have no strong opinions on the matter, but I can see it from both sides.

 

 

Another genius move from Starmer now banning smoking areas outside pubs, is it a distraction or is he really introducing a policy nobody supports for no reason whatsoever god only knows with him

 

Not really sure it will have that much affect, but clearly it's aimed at reducing smokers & linked to the health strategy. Pubs defintely are not going to be shutting in their droves cos smoking is banned in beer gardens. It does seem excessive, but I do see the benefits too.

Relatively nobody likes smoking, not even smokers. This is far more likely to be popular than not, it (pub gardens) is one component of various outdoor places where smoking could be banned according to this policy and the only one of those that's likely to raise eyebrows. Even then the whole environment is made far nicer by banning smoking.

 

Coupled with the Conservative plan to phase out smoking for good returning in some form, and this should be broadly supported.

I'd support at the very least non-smoking areas of pub gardens. I hate having to sit in one and breathe in someone's second hand smoke, plus they absolutely stink. It's one of those things where the smoker has no consideration for those around them just like those who stand in pub, restaurant and hospital doorways smoking leaving you no option other than to walk through it. :puke2:

The 100 more important things wrong with this country and he's going after people being able to smoke in outdoor beer gardens. Do me a bloody favour.

 

There are already significant restrictions placed on smoking, coupled with high rates of additional taxation, its a fair compromise that most people are happy with in its current form, there is no need to change it. In fact I believe tobacco taxation is already ringfenced for the NHS which makes it a better deal than the sugar tax for example which should also be ringfenced for health spending as that is its entire justification.

 

Coupled with the uninspiring rhetoric this week of "things can only get shittier but blame the tories, we're only the ones meant to be in charge of sorting it out" I fear we are only in for a whole load more of this random bollocks that was on absolutley nobody's list of top ten priorities for the country.

@1829172165272580618

 

Seems supported.

 

This is relatively easy to push through in comparison to more deep-seated problems in the country and if it lowers smoking rates, good, that's less of a cost on the health service.