Best of luck, hope it goes well, hopefully just a routine procedure and you'll be home pretty quickly!

 

 

Yes good luck Vid and hurry up back here as we need your insightful Brexit opinions.

Here's how they voted then:

 

 

Customs Union more popular than May's deal is quite interesting - suspect that may command a majority were that combined with confirmatory referendum. E.g. WA passes with political declaration changed to include a permanent CU and this then put back to the British people.

 

I'm sad that the SNP abstained on some of the more sensible / pragmatic softer Brexit options but OH DAMN at TIG voting against everything. Different kind of politics and compromise... yeah.

 

I don't think you can read too much in to that. Both of the SNP and TIG's primary thinking is to stay in the EU. I think whilst there is a strong possibility that they can stay in the EU then they would be stupid to vote for any alternatives right now. I think both would settle for the softer Brexit options if ultimately there was not a chance of staying in the EU, but right now it appears as if there is a realistic possibility of a 2nd Referendum and sure as hell they'd fight tooth and nail to get Remain on the ballot paper.

Yes good luck Vid and hurry up back here as we need your insightful Brexit opinions.

 

I just wish others here appreciated them. ;)

I just wish others here appreciated them. ;)

 

 

Oh I'm sure they do but won't admit it. :D

I just wish others here appreciated them. ;)

 

it would be very quiet in this thread without you, and it forces people to look at their own views (even if not agreeing) so think of it that way as a plus :D

 

 

Hopefullly May’s sly attempt at forcing through her shitty deal will fail again today.

Hopefullly May’s sly attempt at forcing through her shitty deal will fail again today.

 

@1111405505417637888

 

:lol:

Hopefullly May’s sly attempt at forcing through her shitty deal will fail again today.

This is the most nervous I've been about a Brexit vote in a while.

 

I accept that it's entirely possible for the WA to go through eventually and I'm not one of those going all out on stopping Brexit altogether. But for goodness sake, it's important to at least wait until Monday's debate before dozens of Labour MPs vote this through. A softer Brexit is still Brexit, might not even entail freedom of movement - if you have a problem with that - and is highly likely to bring down the current government rather than strengthening it and ushering in an ERG PM.

 

Having done some googling, I'm thinking the following Labour MPs could vote for the WA:

Dan Jarvis

Gloria de Piero

Gareth Snell

Ruth Smeeth

Derek Twigg

 

In addition to the likes of Caroline Flint, who have already voted for it.

 

Again lots of invisible, rather useless MPs with little-to-no engagement on social media, in the House of Commons, in the media etc. Probably even more so than with the ERG dinosaurs. But the rebels will probably come from the list of those who opposed amendment M. We'll see.

Edited March 29, 20196 yr by Harve

Rejected... by 344 votes to 286.

 

Who didn't see that coming?

Rejected... by 344 votes to 286.

 

Who didn't see that coming?

 

Theresa May.

Numerous voices piping up... the deal is dead, serious possibility of revocation, almost certainly taking part in EU elections in most ways forward.

 

Hmm.

 

One immediate concrete thing is that Donald Tusk, a man who has repeatedly shown more care for the citizens of the UK than its own leaders, has called an emergency council for 10th April. That's probably when our fate gets decided. I don't think they'll let the UK crash out now but a consensus in our own parliament seems quite unlikely to be reached.

Yes, not really a surprise.

 

Some classic quotes over the last few days.

 

"Theresa May has fallen on her sword.... and missed". :lol:

 

and from Yanis Varoufakis: "Whether you're a Brexiteer or Remainer, this is a deal a nation signs only when it has been defeated in war. It's not a deal which is fit for purpose for any sovereign country." !!!

Numerous voices piping up... the deal is dead, serious possibility of revocation, almost certainly taking part in EU elections in most ways forward.

 

Hmm.

 

One immediate concrete thing is that Donald Tusk, a man who has repeatedly shown more care for the citizens of the UK than its own leaders, has called an emergency council for 10th April. That's probably when our fate gets decided. I don't think they'll let the UK crash out now but a consensus in our own parliament seems quite unlikely to be reached.

 

It was never going to go through unless the DUP got convinced before she played her final card. Why would a Labour MP vote for it even if they agreed with it? You’re essentially voting for a new PM without a general election. I felt sorry for May before she went full dictator.

 

Monday’s vote will be really interesting now. Sounds like we’re going to have to take part in the European elections.

Yes, not really a surprise.

 

Some classic quotes over the last few days.

 

"Theresa May has fallen on her sword.... and missed". :lol:

 

and from Yanis Varoufakis: "Whether you're a Brexiteer or Remainer, this is a deal a nation signs only when it has been defeated in war. It's not a deal which is fit for purpose for any sovereign country." !!!

 

Very good ones. I've been quite amused by this one from a Cabinet minister when questioned about the vote: 'F*** knows, I'm past caring. It's like the living dead in here. Theresa May is the sole architect of this mess. It's her inability to engage in the most basic human interactions that brought us here.'

 

I suppose amused in the sense that it tells me that the despair is palpable even at the heart of the maelstrom.

I guess the next step comes monday with more debate/voting on the most popular options from the 8 that MPs rejected from the other day? I assume a long delay to brexit is pretty much guaranteed unless Article 50 is revoked? I'm not sure if the EU would allow a no deal to take place.

 

Another referendum/general election is likely if we do get a longer delay. Although I'm not quite sure how a general election will solve much of anything.

I wonder how many Brexit related April Fools jokes we’ll see on Monday.

I guess the next step comes monday with more debate/voting on the most popular options from the 8 that MPs rejected from the other day? I assume a long delay to brexit is pretty much guaranteed unless Article 50 is revoked? I'm not sure if the EU would allow a no deal to take place.

 

Another referendum/general election is likely if we do get a longer delay. Although I'm not quite sure how a general election will solve much of anything.

 

If you want to change the people in parliament who are voting on these deals, then you need a GE. That is the premise.

 

Of course, the EU is not going to offer us much more than we have so...

So another public vote has been rejected, as has no brexit so we're having brexit. But every type of brexit has also been rejected. I'm really glad we voted to take our decision making back from the EU to our own elected officials!

Faisal Islam

‏

Verified account

 

@faisalislam

12m12 minutes ago

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So @SamCoatesTimes says that dozens of MPs next week have a tutorial scheduled on what the customs union is from some trade experts...

 

This is why anyone that tells you No Deal is good is off their teeth on crystal meth - they have no idea.

 

I guess the next step comes monday with more debate/voting on the most popular options from the 8 that MPs rejected from the other day? I assume a long delay to brexit is pretty much guaranteed unless Article 50 is revoked? I'm not sure if the EU would allow a no deal to take place.

 

Another referendum/general election is likely if we do get a longer delay. Although I'm not quite sure how a general election will solve much of anything.

 

Yes, as we will have to take part in European Elections and likely on the proviso of another referendum or general election.

 

The fault of the mess we are in right now falls firmly in the face of May and Corbyn. If they both had not have been so willing to try and become so populist we would not be in this mess at all. May is finished - her party brought down her own deal. The only problem is now we could get someone worse in!

My Wednesday predictions on the Tory rebels and how that turned out. Those who did actually vote for the WA are italicised.

 

Here's how they're divided now:

 

Confirmed opposition

Suella Braverman

Andrea Jenkyns

Andrew Bridgen

Crispin Blunt

Priti Patel

Anne-Marie Trevelyan

(6) 4/6

 

Probably voting against but unconfirmed

Owen Paterson

Mark Francois

Steve Baker

Marcus Fysh

Dominic Raab

Bernard Jenkin

Craig Mackinlay

Anne Marie Morris

Laurence Robertson

(9) 8/9

 

Jury is still out - they are engaging with the Brexit debate on social media/traditional media/within the house of commons but haven't actually indicated how they will vote.

Bill Cash

Michael Tomlinson

John Redwood

Peter Bone

Iain Duncan Smith

David Jones

Andrew Lewer

Sheryll Murray

Tom Pursglove

Andrew Rosindell

Lee Rowley

Michael Tomlinson

Theresa Villiers

John Baron

(14) 8/14

 

? - Literally invisible MPs. No active social media. No media appearances etc. Who are these dinosaurs?

Mark Harper

James Duddridge

Richard Drax

Richard Bacon

Philip Hollobone

Adam Holloway

Ranil Jayawardena

Gareth Johnson

Julian Lewis

Ian Liddell-Grainger

Julia Lopez

Jonathan Lord

Anne Main

Grant Shapps

Bob Stewart

Christopher Chope

David Jones

(17) 9/17

 

Tory ex-Remainers - Not really sure what their conditions are tbh. Their opposition to the WA is very different to others in this list. Most Remain-leaning MPs who rebelled against the whip for other amendments did actually vote for the Withdrawal Agreement.

Guto Bebb

Damian Collins

Michael Fallon

Justine Greening

Dominic Grieve

Sam Gyimah

Jo Johnson

Phillip Lee

(8) 6/8

 

Opened door to possibility of voting but unconfirmed

Chris Green

Charlie Elphicke

Simon Clarke

Adam Afriyie

Boris Johnson

Pauline Latham

Ross Thomson

Craig Tracey

Shailesh Vara

(9) 1/9

 

Already confirmed switch to support - bottom of page

Jacob Rees-Mogg

Daniel Kawczynski

James Gray

Esther McVey

Michael Fabricant

Rehman Chishti

Henry Smith

Eddie Hughes

Gordon Henderson

Lucy Allan

John Whittingdale

Royston Smith

Robert Courts

Conor Burns

(14) 0/14

 

Pretty good I would say!

 

Crispin Blunt flat-out changed his mind. Anne Trevelyan stated that her opposition depended on the DUP's opposition. The DUP of course maintained this but the ERG/DUP alliance is now all but dead, so it makes sense that she did in fact vote for it. The ERG don't care that much about the Union and are happy to lose Northern Ireland and/or Scotland to get what they want - they only care about Brexit. Whereas the DUP don't care so much about Brexit - it's all about the Union. So no wonder it hasn't lasted.

Edited March 29, 20196 yr by Harve